Soft Caps for everything?

[Celeras]

Stack resists, and although the tooltip will scale upwards, anything after X% doesn't reduce additional damage.
Stack Strength, and although the tooltip will continue to scale upwards, anything after X amount doesnt increase your damage any further.

That's what I'm told. True/False? Anybody care to test?

[Utakata]

That would be called a hard cap. A soft cap is like, say you have 20 willpower and it does 20 healing DPS. Then you get 30 willpower and it does 30 healing DPS. Then you get 40 willpower and you only have 39 healing DPS, and it goes down from there. I haven't actually analyzed this in-game but that's my impression of how they do caps, someone else might have some actual numbers for you.

[Jesper]

daoc had soft caps and they worked on a severe diminishing return

IE:
- from 0 to 300 points in Strenght you get 300bonus

- from 300 to 400 you get 25 bonus

- over 400 you get 1 bonus every 40 point


these numbers are fictional. Anyway, even if they were "soft caps" they weren't so soft :D

[Oak]

There was massive amounts of this talk thrown two and a half years ago when everyone knew next to nothing about the game; and predicted it would use the same mechanics as DAoC, which, to an extent was a correct assumption.

I, however, have seen nothing in game that would confirm that this is actually the case in WAR.

I don't believe stat caps currently exist, or if they do, they’re incredibly high. Mythic may instead be intending to keep a close eye on itemisation (which I know is somewhat of a joke at the moment) rather than applying a blanket fix for crazy stat min/maxing like soft stat-capping. I don’t think you’ll get an accurate answer to the question you’ve asked as I doubt many people actually know, or can provide accurate information about solid game mechanics aside the developers themselves.

[Varking]

There was massive amounts of this talk thrown two and a half years ago when everyone knew next to nothing about the game; and predicted it would use the same mechanics as DAoC, which, to an extent was a correct assumption.

I, however, have seen nothing in game that would confirm that this is actually the case in WAR.

I don't believe stat caps currently exist, or if they do, they’re incredibly high. Mythic may instead be intending to keep a close eye on itemisation (which I know is somewhat of a joke at the moment) rather than applying a blanket fix for crazy stat min/maxing like soft stat-capping. I don’t think you’ll get an accurate answer to the question you’ve asked as I doubt many people actually know, or can provide accurate information about solid game mechanics aside the developers themselves.
Armor caps at 75%. You can gain more of the stat but would only be useful when fighting a character that can reduce your armor.

[PiWizard]

I have 917 strength and haven't noticed it cap yet, but then again I haven't really been looking into it too much, guess I should eh.

So I just tried with 917 strength, I was hitting my convulsive slashes for 280 each hit on a winter lynx, I tried again with 853 and I was hitting for 274, so there is a small difference I guess. It increased by debilitate by 17 damages as well.

[Shuryo]

So I just tried with 917 strength, I was hitting my convulsive slashes for 280 each hit on a winter lynx, I tried again with 853 and I was hitting for 274, so there is a small difference I guess. It increased by debilitate by 17 damages as well.

Yeah, Strength adds 1 DPS to abilities per 5 points, so a 65 point difference would be 13 DPS, and since Slashing hits twice a second, each slash will gain 6.5. I've tested Strength past 1200 and there is no cap. In fact, I would be willing to bet no cap exists for any stat except armor and resists.

But it must exist for resists, in some form. Otherwise it would be way too easy to stack 100% from talisman slots.

[Bluefish]

I capped my corporeal resist at 85% at ~ lvl 29-30. Needed 1071 CR for this. I didnt test extensively, but drinking a +189 CR potion whilst at 1005 resist, only buffed it to 1071. Ofcourse, the capped value is level dependent, higher levels will require a higher value for the same result.

[stripsteak]

I capped my corporeal resist at 85% at ~ lvl 29-30. Needed 1071 CR for this. I didnt test extensively, but drinking a +189 CR potion whilst at 1005 resist, only buffed it to 1071. Ofcourse, the capped value is level dependent, higher levels will require a higher value for the same result.

was this based on the tooltip or parseing combat logs? the tooltip for armor mitigation is bugged, and shows mitigation higher than 75% i wouldn't be surprised if the tooltip for resists has a similar problem.

[lasmrah]

was this based on the tooltip or parseing combat logs? the tooltip for armor mitigation is bugged, and shows mitigation higher than 75% i wouldn't be surprised if the tooltip for resists has a similar problem.

That tooltip isn't really bugged, just misleading. If you have a 100% mitigation from armor on the tooltip and someone slams you with a debuff that reduces your armor by 20%, you will drop to 80% mitigation; either way you will still only mitigate 75% of damage in actuality, but the tooltip going over 75% is useful in showing you how much armor debuffing you can take while staying capped.

[Rehk]

1014 Str atm and noticed no capping yet...

[Smasher78]

If stats aren't softcapped but armor/resist are, then defensive stats need to scale better. I'm looking at you, Toughness and Willpower.

[Callibys]

I capped my corporeal resist at 85% at ~ lvl 29-30. Needed 1071 CR for this. I didnt test extensively, but drinking a +189 CR potion whilst at 1005 resist, only buffed it to 1071. Ofcourse, the capped value is level dependent, higher levels will require a higher value for the same result.I am willing to bet that your resists only went up by 65 instead of the 189 listed due to your resist buff being 'overwritten' and the potion being the only thing affecting your corporeal, despite having both buffs on.

[LeviathanXIII]

Armor caps at 75%. You can gain more of the stat but would only be useful when fighting a character that can reduce your armor.

Tested this to not be EXACTLY true.

On my blackguard, I have a self buff called Force of Fury that buffs my own armor by a certain amount (depending on level). Without it, I checked my armor mitigation % as roughly 78%.

Pulled a mob, got a number. Let it beat on me for a while to really get a good sample and examine attacks.

Had a DoK put Covenant of Tenacity on me, putting my armor at about 91%, pulled identical mob, checked logs. Got less damage, more mitigation.

Still with CoT on me, pulled a mob, then cast my self buff. Damage further reduced, mitigation raised even more. Armor mitigation was rated at 102%.

I did not, of course, approach anything like 100% mitigation. However, it definitely mitigated more damage, and it was around 85% total mitigation with both buffs up, give or take.

Haven't tested it extensively but I believe that use of buffs can drive you over 75% but it is apparently impossible to hit anything like 100% mitigation. There's surely a soft cap or diminishing returns, or else some other factor at play.

[Tykero]

Tested this to not be EXACTLY true.

On my blackguard, I have a self buff called Force of Fury that buffs my own armor by a certain amount (depending on level). Without it, I checked my armor mitigation % as roughly 78%.

Pulled a mob, got a number. Let it beat on me for a while to really get a good sample and examine attacks.

Had a DoK put Covenant of Tenacity on me, putting my armor at about 91%, pulled identical mob, checked logs. Got less damage, more mitigation.

Still with CoT on me, pulled a mob, then cast my self buff. Damage further reduced, mitigation raised even more. Armor mitigation was rated at 102%.

I did not, of course, approach anything like 100% mitigation. However, it definitely mitigated more damage, and it was around 85% total mitigation with both buffs up, give or take.

Haven't tested it extensively but I believe that use of buffs can drive you over 75% but it is apparently impossible to hit anything like 100% mitigation. There's surely a soft cap or diminishing returns, or else some other factor at play.

Do you have the exact values saved in a log somewhere?

It could be that the mob had a decent amount of Weapon Skill, which would throw things off a bit.

[athropos]

Offensive stats (STR/INT/BAL) scale linearly without diminishing returns. Had over 4k strength a while back due to a bug, and it still gave the exact same 5str=1dmg bonus all the way up.

[LeviathanXIII]

Do you have the exact values saved in a log somewhere?

It could be that the mob had a decent amount of Weapon Skill, which would throw things off a bit.

I can redo the experiment if you like, but the exact mob was one of the salamander/drakes found at Loryndaal PQ and for it to have weapon skill offsetting that much armor would be impressive. To be sure, I was almost exact in my % mitigation numbers quoted here. In fact, I can take it a step further when I repeat it because I can slap on some Ruin gear, which for BG provides bonus 600+ armor, allowing me a third testable and significant armor boost.

I also wonder - does mob level vs player leve have a proven and known factor in damage taken? I am almost certain, without doing extensive experiments, that this game has a very simple lvl vs lvl damage factor in it, as stat gains at leveling up do not seem to account for the quite noticeable difference in damage done and damage taken from mobs. If anything, leveling up and not changing armor should cause you to take MORE damage from the same mob as the mitigation % from the same numerical armor value decreases with each level, forcing you to update armor to get the same mitigation %.

[Gaarawarr]

I also wonder - does mob level vs player leve have a proven and known factor in damage taken?

Yes. The % shown for mitigation is versus a normal mob of the same level as you. I've done extensive testing on armor and toughness values at lvl 40 versus normal level 40s and 41s as well as champion 40s and hero 40s.

There are armor cap values for each but they are at different levels. Effectively, being a champion/hero/lord/etc is akin to adding "invisible" levels to the mob. Thus, your armor has to be raised accordingly to reach the cap. Additionally, as most should already know, mobs in a dungeon also do more damage due to similar kinds of "invisible" levels.

Currently, I can easily cap the armor level for regular lvl 40s as well as champion lvl 40s using armor, armor buff special and armor buff standard. This is as a tank however. If you're not a tank, it would be extremely difficult to cap armor even for regular and champ lvl 40s, let alone heros or dungeons, so the cap argument has nothing to do with you. :p

For toughness, there is no cap that I've found. There is, however, a diminishing returns curve it seems at the extreme levels.

What I've found so far with those two is that a good mix of both provides excellent defense while stacking just one over the other is only good in specific situations. As a tank, I try to be ready for any situation so don't stack to any one stat, but instead buff them all up as much as I can. For certain 1on1 dungeon encounters, I'll stack to what I know will most help, but otherwise, I don't bother.

[LeviathanXIII]

Yes. The % shown for mitigation is versus a normal mob of the same level as you. I've done extensive testing on armor and toughness values at lvl 40 versus normal level 40s and 41s as well as champion 40s and hero 40s.

There are armor cap values for each but they are at different levels. Effectively, being a champion/hero/lord/etc is akin to adding "invisible" levels to the mob. Thus, your armor has to be raised accordingly to reach the cap. Additionally, as most should already know, mobs in a dungeon also do more damage due to similar kinds of "invisible" levels.

Currently, I can easily cap the armor level for regular lvl 40s as well as champion lvl 40s using armor, armor buff special and armor buff standard. This is as a tank however. If you're not a tank, it would be extremely difficult to cap armor even for regular and champ lvl 40s, let alone heros or dungeons, so the cap argument has nothing to do with you. :p

For toughness, there is no cap that I've found. There is, however, a diminishing returns curve it seems at the extreme levels.

What I've found so far with those two is that a good mix of both provides excellent defense while stacking just one over the other is only good in specific situations. As a tank, I try to be ready for any situation so don't stack to any one stat, but instead buff them all up as much as I can. For certain 1on1 dungeon encounters, I'll stack to what I know will most help, but otherwise, I don't bother.

Very helpful to know. I did all this armor stuff on a blackguard, not my witch elf, hehe.

This explains why keeping armor as much over 75% as possible seems to help drastically with endgame tanking.