Starting out painting

[Tuqui]

So, looking around at the miniatures I wanted to give painting them a try. I have no experience whatsoever in miniatures (and very little painting experience - with the exception of a couple of classes in college) so I wanted to come to you for advice. I like the concept of the Sisters of Battle and maybe get a couple of those models paired up with a witch hunter or two and put them up for display.

My question is, am I going overboard with said miniatures? I wanted to try something cheap first and then maybe move on to the more expensive units. But are the sisters and hunters a good choice to start with? Or should I spend 10-15 dollars on an easier model and learn/ruin it.

Thanks for any input :)

[Direlord]

all sisters are pewter which means they will be more expensive. not sure what WH model your looking at unless its an inquisitor model.

however if you sound like you just want to do about 3 things for display that is your best bet as plastics come in more expensive boxes but you also get like 10 models.

just remember to clean the models, file any mold lines, cutting off chaff, prime your models. take your time thin your paints especially if you use the GW stuff. a few coats of thinned paint looks a lot better than 1 coat of straight out of the pot.

[Dropkick Murphy]

I can not stress how important it is to thin your paint. It's probably the number 1 reason why people's models look like crap.

Also, make sure you primer with spray paint first. I've found that a can of car primer is the best stuff on earth for priming minis.

Also, be aware that this is a very, very, very expensive hobby, BUT man, it's so much fun. I personally have never played WH, I played Warmachine, but I have used both paints and I prefer the Privateer Press Paint.

Also, buy the model you want, as long as it's pewter you can always strip it and start all over.

[Svartmetall]

posting from work

Allow me to once again recommend the excellent RelicNews Painting & Modelling forums (http://forums.relicnews.com/forumdisplay.php?f=110) - they're a good bunch of people and have been very helpful to me with my fledgling modelling career. If you ask for advice and C&C on models you've done there you'll get some very useful feedback, I know it's helped me immensely.

[Tatile]

Also, buy the model you want, as long as it's pewter you can always strip it and start all over.

Simple Green is an all-purpose organic cleaner that's great for stripping anything, so see if you can get yourself some of that. It works on plastic and metal without damaging them (it doesn't always get all the layers of paint off if you've glossed it to hell and back, also primer can be a bit patchy).

Get a bathroom tile for paint mixing and thinning, they're easy to wash and quite durable (so long as you don't drop them). Go with simple schemes for beginning and don't worry about your cloth not looking amazing. Get some decent brushes (some of the hobby sites/forums may have advice, I know one of the 40k podcasts had an article about brushes a while back) and keep them in good condition and such.

Uh, yeah. Just remember drybrushing and washing and you should be fine!

[erloas]

Also, make sure you primer with spray paint first. I've found that a can of car primer is the best stuff on earth for priming minis.

I would not suggest using car primer. Car primer is designed to expand and fill in cracks, that is what it is designed to do to give a car a nice smooth surface. However that is exactly not what you want to happen with miniatures because it hides detail.

I've tried it on some cheap plastic models and I could still notice a difference on those basic models. I haven't been too impressed with the Armoury primers either. I have found GW primer to be by far the best from what I've tried, it costs a fair amount more, but considering how much money a can of primer can cover (in terms of model cost) I just can't justify trying to save $3-4 at that point when it could easily screw things up.

[Dropkick Murphy]

I would not suggest using car primer. Car primer is designed to expand and fill in cracks, that is what it is designed to do to give a car a nice smooth surface. However that is exactly not what you want to happen with miniatures because it hides detail.

I've tried it on some cheap plastic models and I could still notice a difference on those basic models. I haven't been too impressed with the Armoury primers either. I have found GW primer to be by far the best from what I've tried, it costs a fair amount more, but considering how much money a can of primer can cover (in terms of model cost) I just can't justify trying to save $3-4 at that point when it could easily screw things up.


I'm no golden demon winner or anything, and I'm not going to get into a pissing match about painting, but seriously if you don't know about Duplicolor car primer or how great it is to paint on, I'm not sure you have done much painting yourself.

Go to ANY mini painting site and you will see people swear by it. I do.

[erloas]

Well I can easily admit I haven't tried every brand of primer out there. But there is a difference between recommending a very specific type of primer and just a generic primer. From what you said I got the impression you were suggesting to just go to Wal-Mart and pick up a can of Krylon primer or something. A quick search shows that Dupli-color makes primer and filler primer and that would be something to point out to new painters wouldn't know to look for that sort of thing.

I haven't researched into primer a whole lot, I was just going by the bit of testing I have done. I'm sure there are plenty of other good primers out there, but GW is good and it is generally fairly easy to find and regonize and easy to recommend because of it.

Can you get it at normal auto parts stores like Checker and Autozone? I've been wanting to find a place to get good primer locally, since I have to order almost everything now.

*and not that I should address such a trollish statement, but something like painting can be learned without having to research it greatly on the net. I'm sure there are plenty of very good painters that have never went to a painting forum. I've been painting for 4-5 years now, and I'm not amazing but I'm not bad either, and the bit of research I've done on it in that time I haven't see anyone else suggest that primer.

[Tuqui]

:o

Thanks for the awesome responses. I think I might start off with a squad of sister (only 15 dollars!) and go from there. Primer, GW paint watered down to the density of milk, and a few detail brushes. Sounds easy enought :p

EDIT: By the way, how do you strip paint? Is the model salvageable after several restarts? Or do models start losing their form from too many chemicals being applied?

[Tatile]

EDIT: By the way, how do you strip paint? Is the model salvageable after several restarts? Or do models start losing their form from too many chemicals being applied?

Stripping is pretty easy. Just get a tupperware boix of whatever your using and dump the models in it for a while. Depending on the stripper, the time varies. Ceratin strippers, if you leave the models in for too long, you will start to lose detail. This is why I suggested Simple Green if you can get it, it strips pewter and plastic easily, and it's a 'dump and forget' liquid (my boyfriend has had plastic Marines in there for about a month).

The other one reccomended is Fairy Power Spray, but that doesn't always work all that well.

When you take them models out, give them a good scrub with an old toothbrush. Use a sink and some running water or something (depending on the stripper) to get rid of the waste. You should be fine.

[Direlord]

Not really a good idea to want to strip the models a lot it isn't like a oops i made a mistake type of thing. if you want do a test model to get your color scheme and basics on painting.

i have never stripped a model but i agree with tatile that i heard simple green is great. let is soak for awhile then take a toothbrush to it.

i do believe it is easier to strip a pewter models but i also heard the glue might corrode too which isn't much of a problem to reglue something.

with thinning paints if you screw up you can just paint over or quickly wipe it away and paint over to fix it. with this way it is also a good idea to plan how you do things.

my scheme for my now retired chaos marines was first black primer, then i would go over model with heavily watered down black mixed with black ink. This is only done so it looks like chaos black and not just primer. scab red on the shoulder trim, leg, backpack trim, codex gray for shoulders, red gore over the scab red, fortress gray over the codex. then build up blood red over the red usually 2 coats, and skull white over the gray usually 3-4 coats. i would then trim the shoulders with a little codex gray to help destinguish the red and white on the shoulders. Redo white as needed. scorpion green for my eyes, dark angels green for my tubeing, chaos symbols would be tin bitz, brazen brass, shining gold, watered down brown ink. codex gray line highlight armor. purple i think lich but maybe warlock for any hair cloth etc. any horns would be codex gray, bleached bone usually x2, skull white drybrush/highlight usually with a brown ink near the base of the horn/tusk.

guns would be tin bitz, drybrushing boltgun, light brown ink with pva glue mix. red for any icons skulls arrows etc.

[Dropkick Murphy]

*and not that I should address such a trollish statement,


Erloas, you caught me at a bad time, and I apologize for my unfiltered statement. Been having a bad week and it's no excuse for me acting stupid.

On the note of researching the internet for painting tips and tutorials. I guess it depends how much you want to get into it, but for me, my painting went from "WTF is that?" to people drooling over my army during a game. And quite frankly, I SUCK at anything artistic, I'm just a good tutorial reader. :)

But if you want to paint cause it's fun, screw it, who cares what it looks like if you are having fun doing it.

[Dropkick Murphy]

:o

EDIT: By the way, how do you strip paint? Is the model salvageable after several restarts? Or do models start losing their form from too many chemicals being applied?


Simple Green is awesome for stripping. The glue from your models will get brittle and I suggest you reglue it, but the model should be fine. Just find an old tooth brush and start scrubbing.

[Tuqui]

So, I asked this in Relic News as well. But because I don't know how quickly they reply there Im going to ask here too:

1) So I received them and I noticed they were about 1 inch in height. Sweet jeebus, I hope this is what everyone is painting because you need to have a hand of steel in order to paint details into these things. Are all factions/races/models all the same height?

2) What is the usual squad size? I planned on having a commander, two bodyguards and maybe 3 or 4 soldiers all facing the same number, and hierarchy, of chaos-driven sisters. I know there hasn't been a documented case of chaos sisters but since this is for display only, Im sure you wont mind.

3) Are the Sisters of Battle clones? I ask because the majority I see all have white hair. Is this a generic trait or is it creed? I ask because the Chaos sisters would have their hair in a different color to go against everything their empire sisters stand for.

[Cave_Troll]

Simple Green is awesome for stripping. The glue from your models will get brittle and I suggest you reglue it, but the model should be fine. Just find an old tooth brush and start scrubbing.

(disclaimer: use the paint stripper you like, I am just giving my IMO from my experience. If you swear by simple green then thats cool, sorry I am used to being attacked by simple green users)

I tried all the "safe" stripping tech myself. I call them safe because most painting site's or forums that discuss stripping mini's, only seems to want people to use them.

Now simple green is a nice stripper for plastics, as it want harm the plastic. But to be honest when it comes down to stripping the metal mini's I suggest picking up some "real" paint stripper. I am not trying to attack the simple green users, but I have seen a lot of people make paint strippers out to be radioactive toxic waste.
First a "real paint stripper is going to take all the paint off, and I mean all. There will be little to any scrubbing of a mini, to get paint out of the cracks etc. Most cases and this depends on the stripper, its going to strip the paint in a short amount of time. In some cases 10 mins or less, simple green or other non stripping stuff your going to have to soak for days. A good glass jar, an old tooth brush and some chemical resistant gloves is all you need.

I have stripped a lot of mini's more then I am sure most people, as I would buy mini's from other players, or off Ebay. One of the best tricks to save a nice junk of money is to buy pre painted mini's, I am not talking about the guys trying to sell there "pro" painted stuff(which looks terrible in most cases). But the stuff that been started or not so good paint jobs, you can pick these up for next to nothing in most cases. Throw them in some paint stripper and you got a new mini.


To the Primer I have 6 cans of duplicolor car primer myself in white and gray, hands down some of the best primer out there for mini's. Krylon primer is pretty nice also, but in the end use what you like. I know some people will take the "canned" primer and spray it into a bottle then airbrush it on for even better coverage, I don't see a difference myself.

I'm sure there are plenty of very good painters that have never went to a painting forum. I've been painting for 4-5 years now, and I'm not amazing but I'm not bad either, and the bit of research I've done on it in that time I haven't see anyone else suggest that primer.

This is how I started painting, there was no painting websites, or books for that matter. I would just try to copy what the picture looked like if I had a picture. I started painting back during the rogue trader days, most of my first mini's I started painting on were the west end games Star Wars mini's. lol mini's were made out of lead in my day, little to any platics.

[Direlord]

So, I asked this in Relic News as well. But because I don't know how quickly they reply there Im going to ask here too:

1) So I received them and I noticed they were about 1 inch in height. Sweet jeebus, I hope this is what everyone is painting because you need to have a hand of steel in order to paint details into these things. Are all factions/races/models all the same height?

2) What is the usual squad size? I planned on having a commander, two bodyguards and maybe 3 or 4 soldiers all facing the same number, and hierarchy, of chaos-driven sisters. I know there hasn't been a documented case of chaos sisters but since this is for display only, Im sure you wont mind.

3) Are the Sisters of Battle clones? I ask because the majority I see all have white hair. Is this a generic trait or is it creed? I ask because the Chaos sisters would have their hair in a different color to go against everything their empire sisters stand for.

1) Model should be near 2 inch in height. drybrushing and washes can be great for details if you don't have a very steady hand. for chainmail type stuff i just drybrush metal over black works good.

2) usual squad size i would say is 10 models. Commands can be much smaller can be a 5 model command squad. a good model that might be used for chaos commander could be a sister repentia mistress. can't beat a nun with dual whips.

3) most if not all sisters are orphans taken over by a convent and taught since childhood to worship the emperor have strong faith, not all sisters are battle sisters. there is also the sisters hospitalar (sp) basically battlefield medics, sisters diagolus i think translaters and administration. While i do notice a lot of white hair i don't think there is any fluff saying they will have that except maybe the sister superior as she is probably a older veteran.

i'll have to look at my witch hunter book to try to get some details but the fluff in the old books isn't very much. whenever they get a new book should have a large fluff section even though rumors i'm hearing the new book will be all 3 inquisitor armies sisters, grey knights, deathwatch.

disregard a lot of spelling errors i'm at work and don't have the book infront of me to check.

just a edit there is a novel for sisters called Faith and Fire and i think they describe the sisters as having normal colored hair most brunette, some blonde, some red etc.