Warrior Priest Healing

[Of_the_Gods]

Personally, I am glad that I will be healing as a warrior priest, and I find it loads of fun to stand around and heal in pvp and pve. I loved the wow Paladin, where I would wear awsome armour and heal. I loved that and I hope the warrior Priest turns into the same thing. I dont want to run up and dps. I wanna stand back and just heal (or wherever the warrior priest should stand, maybe next to the fray but I dont wanna waste time dpsing to build up RF).

EDIT: Does anyone know anything better to stand back and just heal with?

[Archin]

The warrior priest requires that you be in mele to gain RF (rightous fury) you can then spend this RF on healing you or your team mates;

Playing as a Warrior Priest
As a Warrior Priest, your place is in battle. Your Righteous Fury grows as you strike down the enemy in Sigmar’s name, and your divine powers grow with Righteous Fury. Thus, to reach the peak of your power you must join in the fight. Your prayers bear the power of your god to take life, or give it back, but they are designed to compliment your melee capabilities. Your blessings bring powerful boons to those around you, but you must be close to the fight for your words to reach them. To do your job you must place yourself at risk, but it is in this risky position which you are most powerful.

Maby the goblin shaman is for you if you like to stand back because he is a healer / ranged caster

[Dasquigman]

yea I was thinking the same thing either a gobby shaman or a zelot they are both ranged casters and can heal.....or a rune priest I think but im not sure

edit: yea I gess you could play a rune priest but not so much healing but using your runes to protect and heal them but not alot of healing... but if you are those guys that just want to support his team rune priest is the class for you! that is if you want to stay on order..
If not then yea go shaman or a zelot

[Archin]

yeah :D .

[Of_the_Gods]

yea I was thinking the same thing either a gobby shaman or a zelot they are both ranged casters and can heal.....or a rune priest I think but im not sure

yeah Im thinking about Zealot...they look like someone to sit back and heal.

[Thoden Firehammer]

yeah Im thinking about Zealot...they look like someone to sit back and heal.

Nope they're melee as well...

[Thunder_Head]

Wouldn't a rune Priest be the closest thing to what he's looking for?

[Thoden Firehammer]

Wouldn't a rune Priest be the closest thing to what he's looking for?

He'd mostliekly like these classes

Runepriest.
Goblin Shaman.
Dark Elf healer class
High Elf Archmage

[Rivers]

Nope they're melee as well...

There is nothing melee about the Zealot. Despite what Mythic has said, there is no reason for the lightly-armored Zealot to engage in melee combat (I should know, I played a Zealot at Gamesday Baltimore).

[Thoden Firehammer]

There is nothing melee about the Zealot.

Ahh my mistake.

[Of_the_Gods]

hm, yes a zealot seems to grab my attention

[Thunder_Head]

hm, yes a zealot seems to grab my attention

Uhh..?! I think the Dark Elf Healing class might be pwnage. Also...Shaman > Zealot.

[Crazy ol' dude]

Thing is, most of support careers have to do other things than healing to be most effective...WP has to build up RP, Shaman - Waaagh and Zealot most likely will be able to power up his buffed allies by damaging debuffed enemies...that's at least what we can read in his desciption, that system is just not yet in (i think)

If you want to stand at the back and heal - i advise you to play a Runepriest. He buffs up and heals at the back and throws some AoE runes on the ground (buffs). They'll also most likely be underplayed on the release i suppose...but remember that, according to what Mythic has said, in WAR only healing around will be way less effective than using all of your career's abilities

[Donsiku]

Personally, I am glad that I will be healing as a warrior priest, and I find it loads of fun to stand around and heal in pvp and pve. I loved the wow Paladin, where I would wear awsome armour and heal. I loved that and I hope the warrior Priest turns into the same thing. I dont want to run up and dps. I wanna stand back and just heal (or wherever the warrior priest should stand, maybe next to the fray but I dont wanna waste time dpsing to build up RF).

EDIT: Does anyone know anything better to stand back and just heal with?


Warrior Priest is not a pure healing class by the fact that it is absolutely necessary for you to get in melee range to build up Righteous Fury to use your character to the fullest extent, if you don't do that then you aren't playing your class correctly.

I would suggest you to look for other classes such as Runepriests, Gobbo Shamans and such. Every race have their own healing class and at the same time they have different ways to support their teammates and to heal them.

[HulkSmash!]

Actually, I'm pretty sure it'll work like this.
Healing mechanic power

Order/Destruction
Debuffer/buffer - Rune Priest/Zealot
Magic DPS - Archmage/Shaman
Melee - Warrior Priest/DE healer

[Boris Olfhamar]

The mere thought you want to stand back and be a pure healbot sickens me, if you want to be a medic who does nothing but spam a heal button, this game isn't for you.

[heavyhebrew]

The mere thought you want to stand back and be a pure healbot sickens me, if you want to be a medic who does nothing but spam a heal button, this game isn't for you.

QFT!

OP: You should wait for the release of My Little Pony Online.

[Jonas]

The mere thought you want to stand back and be a pure healbot sickens me, if you want to be a medic who does nothing but spam a heal button, this game isn't for you.

While the game has evidenced a support for other activities, who are you to say that what he likes is badwrongfun?

To elaborate: I'd have no beef with you saying "Hey, to get the most out of healers in this game, you have to do more than just stand back and heal". But saying "The mere thought you want to stand back and be a pure healbot sickens me" is not at all constructive, and will only convince the weakest of individuals. Games are about fun, if his fun is healing people, let him have his fun; just because you don't think it's fun doesn't make it bad that he does.

As it stands, from what we know: the game supports this idea by taking the position that you can sit back and heal exclusively, but you become more effective if you do more than that. If it was still the old model where you had to dps to heal, then your position would be supported, but as all evidence that we have seen has indicated that dps only makes your healing more effective, in essence, mythic is saying "play the way you want to play, but we're putting the justification in for you to do more than just heal"

PS. There's every chance he's a troll :p

[Perp]

Nope they're melee as well...

wrong there

[Perp]

Actually, I'm pretty sure it'll work like this.
Healing mechanic power

Order/Destruction
Debuffer/buffer - Rune Priest/Zealot
Magic DPS - Archmage/Shaman
Melee - Warrior Priest/DE healer

Good chance.

But back to the WP healing; there will be times when it will be best for you to sit back and heal. I'm not saying it's always going to be the right thing to do, but it will be effective untill you are targeted by ranged caster classes. Much like the wow paladin if specced (morale, tactics) for healing and toting a shield they will be a major pain in the arse to take down.

[Aethelbeorht]

While the game has evidenced a support for other activities, who are you to say that what he likes is badwrongfun?


To quote Paul Barnett:
"There will not be any namby pamby healer only classes. There is no sitting at the back going 'and I heal, and I heal, and I heal, and I heal, and I heal' because it's boring. I'm really sorry, if you're really one of those people who just likes being a medic, who likes sitting at the back not doing anything, going 'and I heal, and I heal, and I heal,' go away." [...] "We're telling you now. We're not looking for you."

So, while Boris may not exactly be Paul, his opinion does seem resemble that of someone who does matter.

[Perp]

To quote Paul Barnett:
"There will not be any namby pamby healer only classes. There is no sitting at the back going 'and I heal, and I heal, and I heal, and I heal, and I heal' because it's boring. I'm really sorry, if you're really one of those people who just likes being a medic, who likes sitting at the back not doing anything, going 'and I heal, and I heal, and I heal,' go away." [...] "We're telling you now. We're not looking for you."

So, while Boris may not exactly be Paul, his opinion does seem resemble that of someone who does matter.

Let me introduce you to a term the rest of the world calls SPIN.

Spin - to present (as information) with a particular spin <spin the statistics>.


All the healing archtypes have "other" stuff to do, but if they have healers in the game people will expect heals (it's your job) and a lot of people will grasp the concept that loosing a member of your team means you aren't doing your job.

[Aethelbeorht]

Let me introduce you to a term the rest of the world calls SPIN.

Spin - to present (as information) with a particular spin <spin the statistics>.


All the healing archtypes have "other" stuff to do, but if they have healers in the game people will expect heals (it's your job) and a lot of people will grasp the concept that loosing a member of your team means you aren't doing your job.

Ah. So, the fact that none of the classes are designed for players who "wanna stand back and just heal" as the OP desires, is spin? Funny. Here I thought that was a part of the mechanics, that there is no class who's sole job is to stand in the back and just heal.

I get that people expect heals. I also get that I'd rather have in my party a warrior priest up on the lines beating people for his RF than one who stands in the back doing nothing but healing, since the mechanics say that the guy doing damage will also be a better healer. So it's more likely that someone, like the OP, who stands in the back just healing would be less effective... and so it would be more probable that a team member is lost. Not to mention the damage he wouldn't be doing.

You can claim that warrior priests healing better when the hit people with hammers is spin all you want, but the fact is, it's an integral part of their healing mechanic. It's cold hard fact.

[Perp]

Ah. So, the fact that none of the classes are designed for players who "wanna stand back and just heal" as the OP desires, is spin? Funny. Here I thought that was a part of the mechanics, that there is no class who's sole job is to stand in the back and just heal.

I get that people expect heals. I also get that I'd rather have in my party a warrior priest up on the lines beating people for his RF than one who stands in the back doing nothing but healing, since the mechanics say that the guy doing damage will also be a better healer. So it's more likely that someone, like the OP, who stands in the back just healing would be less effective... and so it would be more probable that a team member is lost. Not to mention the damage he wouldn't be doing.

You can claim that warrior priests healing better when the hit people with hammers is spin all you want, but the fact is, it's an integral part of their healing mechanic. It's cold hard fact.

First of all the WP isn't the only healing class in the game. So far we only have in game information on 4 healing classes and only 2 of which have any mechanic that limits their healing. The other two have weaksauce dps.

You sir don't see the spin. The truth is that giving healers high dps with heals makes them completely imbalanced and overpowered. Hence, you give some of the healers (I call them hybrid healers) some pretty decent dps potential if they spend their fury/waaagh with damage abilities. The balance is that their heals spend the same fury/waaagh. Now EAmythic get to give you the "no mamby pamby" healer they promised, but all you really have is a typical hybrid shackled with limitations.

Want me to show you a class that can sit back and heal? A zealot is perfectly capable of just sitting back and healing as he has no mechanic limiting his healing and his only other in combat support ability is a ranged AOE ground target debuff. So yeah in an tightly run RvR guild he'll just stand back and heal; player decision.

Concerning the WP. Use your math skill and prove to me that charging into the front imediately as a WP is more beneficial to your group than standing back to heal when needed; include the extra damage you will take by constantly being surrounded by melee.

It's the assumption of players (especially young players) that the warrior priest is going to have massive dps and will be able to live of the front lines of battle. Sadly this will create a bunch of warrior priests who don't offer any support at all, spending all of their AP on dps and only healing when they themselves need a heal. I wouldn't care to have a support spot in my lineup wasted on that guy.

[BlackRose]

First of all the WP isn't the only healing class in the game. So far we only have in game information on 4 healing classes and only 2 of which have any mechanic that limits their healing. The other two have weaksauce dps.

You sir don't see the spin. The truth is that giving healers high dps with heals makes them completely imbalanced and overpowered. Hence, you give some of the healers (I call them hybrid healers) some pretty decent dps potential if they spend their fury/waaagh with damage abilities. The balance is that their heals spend the same fury/waaagh. Now EAmythic get to give you the "no mamby pamby" healer they promised, but all you really have is a typical hybrid shackled with limitations.

Want me to show you a class that can sit back and heal? A zealot is perfectly capable of just sitting back and healing as he has no mechanic limiting his healing and his only other in combat support ability is a ranged AOE ground target debuff. So yeah in an tightly run RvR guild he'll just stand back and heal; player decision.

Concerning the WP. Use your math skill and prove to me that charging into the front imediately as a WP is more beneficial to your group than standing back to heal when needed; include the extra damage you will take by constantly being surrounded by melee.

It's the assumption of players (especially young players) that the warrior priest is going to have massive dps and will be able to live of the front lines of battle. Sadly this will create a bunch of warrior priests who don't offer any support at all, spending all of their AP on dps and only healing when they themselves need a heal. I wouldn't care to have a support spot in my lineup wasted on that guy.


I think you should make up your mind first, wether your concerned about WP in solo situation or group situations. You already pointed out how WP dps isn't imbalanced since they can't do both at the same time yet they are because they have healing and dps?

On to other things there are indeed more than one healing class in the game...ones that don't subject themselves to stuns, knock downs and other spell counters just to get better heals. I believe its arrogant long term players who are just selfish trying to give people roles. 90% of the time its not the old support class trying to help his fellow members its the class who needs the support whining trying to put someone in thier place.

The melee oriented WP build will consist of monstly instant, swing based heals, and mabey throw in HoTs. Which should be good enough for the extra damage hes outputting specially when its...lets say 5vs5 and you burst down 1 now its 5vs4. If someone dies so fast that the WP needs to sit back and only used weakened heals..I don't blame the WP. Ever since I played EQ2's pvp servers I learned something very interesting. If someone dies other than the tank quickly...its the tanks fault, use your taunts and CC to take control of the battle. Don't just run in trying to smack something down, your no better than a WP who doesn't spend any RF on heals.

[Perp]

I only responed intially because of Aethelbeorht posting the following quote.

To quote Paul Barnett:
"There will not be any namby pamby healer only classes. There is no sitting at the back going 'and I heal, and I heal, and I heal, and I heal, and I heal' because it's boring. I'm really sorry, if you're really one of those people who just likes being a medic, who likes sitting at the back not doing anything, going 'and I heal, and I heal, and I heal,' go away." [...] "We're telling you now. We're not looking for you."

I think Paul is kick , but I'm sick to death of people quoting crap like this nonstop. He's a spin doctor and a color guy responsible for making sure the game is warhammery and to get people excited about it. He is not however in charge of EAMythic nor is he calling all the shots on class balance, game mechanics and general gameplay design.

Basically if you have healers in the game, people will take their healer out of harms way and heal their team. Why? They realize a dead healer can't heal anyone and healing is OP in PvP. Try running 6 dps VS. 4 dps 2 healers and let me know how well you did.

[Fyaniz]

healing is OP in PvP.

That's really not an absolute truth that cannot be changed, it depends on how fast the heals are, and how fast the damage is (not to mention that in the case of cast time heals, they can often be shut down). If they indeed are OP, then it's just a question of balancing the numbers. Just because some games (maybe even most, that's not really the issue) put major focus on healing doesn't mean they all have to.
An extreme example could be making heals so slow that they are totally ineffective in combat, so they would only serve as help once a battle is won, reinforcing the survivors of a node capture so they could better guard it against opponents trying to retake it for example.

Saying that healing is OP is no more true than saying that snaring or stunning is (although that is also true for a number of games). It's all about how much power you put behind the mechanic. In other words, it's all about numbers.

Now, I'm not saying that healing isn't OP in WAR, because frankly I have no idea (have not played it at all, maybe you have), but it doesn't have to be that way.

[BlackRose]

Depends on debuffs used to negate healing if availible and focus fire. Pure DPS has be used its just needed to be used effectively. Differnce in warhammer, they toned down CC alot compared to WoW and tons compared to DAoC where a properly run train didn't even need healers just 1 CC and pure dps to kill them all before it wears off or purged.

[Der_Eisenhans]

My brethren, I believe we are being trolled ;)

[Aethelbeorht]

Who, the OP or Perp? Either way, I like a good debate.

@ Perp: If you're sick of people quoting Paul, perhaps a quote from someone who was at one of the game day things would be better?

"The great thing about it... is that noone can force you to sit back and heal, because you will be terrible at it. You MUST fight to be an effective healer."

And before you dispute that, let me say a bit about the WP abilities as so far recorded from in game play:
6 heals spend RF, including the only listed group heal. In fact, I don't see any listed heals that don't spend RF. Yes, I know it's only Beta, etc. Those are still the mechanics as currently implemented. So the question you really should be asking yourself is this: Which is better, 4 dps and 2 who do mostly dps and occasionally toss off a heal (I'm going with worst case scenario, which is them using only the melee attack which also heals allies, rather than being competent), or 4 dps and 2 who do pretty much crap as far as healing goes and no dps?

[Perp]

Who, the OP or Perp? Either way, I like a good debate.

@ Perp: If you're sick of people quoting Paul, perhaps a quote from someone who was at one of the game day things would be better?

"The great thing about it... is that noone can force you to sit back and heal, because you will be terrible at it. You MUST fight to be an effective healer."

And before you dispute that, let me say a bit about the WP abilities as so far recorded from in game play:
6 heals spend RF, including the only listed group heal. In fact, I don't see any listed heals that don't spend RF. Yes, I know it's only Beta, etc. Those are still the mechanics as currently implemented. So the question you really should be asking yourself is this: Which is better, 4 dps and 2 who do mostly dps and occasionally toss off a heal (I'm going with worst case scenario, which is them using only the melee attack which also heals allies, rather than being competent), or 4 dps and 2 who do pretty much crap as far as healing goes and no dps?

There is a difference between sitting in the back to healing and staying "out of harms way". Melee dps will almost always want to beat up on ranged dps (clothies) so you could hang back with them a bit to snare the melee going after them, beat on them building RF and keeping them up. Ergo you are staying out of the melee gangbang while still using all of your abilities.

[Perp]

My brethren, I believe we are being trolled ;)

If that's all you have to add please sit quietly in the corner and let the grown ups discuss things.

[Atekimogus]

Let me introduce you to a term the rest of the world calls SPIN.

Spin - to present (as information) with a particular spin <spin the statistics>.


All the healing archtypes have "other" stuff to do, but if they have healers in the game people will expect heals (it's your job) and a lot of people will grasp the concept that loosing a member of your team means you aren't doing your job.

The game isn't even out yet and you already are telling the healers how they have to play their class? (Are you by chance one of those leet wow-warriors who where charging 5 warlocks, 3 mages and a few rogues and than were complaining about not receiving enough healing love?)

In my experience (at least on my server) healers were by far the more intelligent players but it boogles my mind why still everyone thinks he must tell them how to play while the people who play dps classes are imho NOT the more skilled players.

Warhammer will really be interesting because it seems especially all the tank classes seem to have a lot of utility. And, my friend, I tell you right now that only a tank who also uses all his abilities and not just his "I am da big bad orkse boss kill kill waaagh" dps skills has a right to complain about incompetent healers.

[Der_Eisenhans]

If that's all you have to add please sit quietly in the corner and let the grown ups discuss things.

Whatever. We have the developers' quotes on this, to which your only answer is "Duh, it's spin". If that isn't trolling, then I dunno.

[balls055]

what made me quit wow...was because of ppl like you.

not everyone loves to sit back and heal.....try to have an open mind.

if ur one of those hardcorse...eq...or wow players....who decides how someone else should play ......all i can say is....

EVOLVE .....

I would take the warrior priest..bash and heal role ANYDAY [even if its just a spin like you say] then BEING TOLD ....to stand back and heal by some leet gamer...and being laughed at when a wow paladin tries to do some melee.

[Garathos]

what made me quit wow...was because of ppl like you.

not everyone loves to sit back and heal.....try to have an open mind.

if ur one of those hardcorse...eq...or wow players....who decides how someone else should play ......all i can say is....

EVOLVE .....

I would take the warrior priest..bash and heal role ANYDAY [even if its just a spin like you say] then BEING TOLD ....to stand back and heal by some leet gamer...and being laughed at when a wow paladin tries to do some melee.
QFT. All this guy has said so far is that its spin and he asks that other guy to back up reasoning for why he is a moron? lol

[Perp]

QFT. All this guy has said so far is that its spin and he asks that other guy to back up reasoning for why he is a moron? lol

I was refering to Paul's general quote on healers (the mamby pamby one) in WAR as being spin; ie making them look a lot tougher than they are and that healing isn't going to be a big part of war.

Sadly that just isn't true; healing will be a big part of war. Just look at the runepriest and the zealot. Your failing to see his words as mere hype isn't my problem.

[Perp]

The game isn't even out yet and you already are telling the healers how they have to play their class? (Are you by chance one of those leet wow-warriors who where charging 5 warlocks, 3 mages and a few rogues and than were complaining about not receiving enough healing love?)

In my experience (at least on my server) healers were by far the more intelligent players but it boogles my mind why still everyone thinks he must tell them how to play while the people who play dps classes are imho NOT the more skilled players.

Warhammer will really be interesting because it seems especially all the tank classes seem to have a lot of utility. And, my friend, I tell you right now that only a tank who also uses all his abilities and not just his "I am da big bad orkse boss kill kill waaagh" dps skills has a right to complain about incompetent healers.

I'm telling them the role of their archtype, not how to play their class. I didn't play a warrior in wow, I played a shaman who I'd specced enh, ele, and resto at various times. I've played my fair share of dps classes as well in various games so don't try to belittle my opinion based on what you assume about me.

[Perp]

Whatever. We have the developers' quotes on this, to which your only answer is "Duh, it's spin". If that isn't trolling, then I dunno.

If calling someone a troll isn't trolling, then I dunno.

[Aethelbeorht]

I was refering to Paul's general quote on healers (the mamby pamby one) in WAR as being spin; ie making them look a lot tougher than they are and that healing isn't going to be a big part of war.

Sadly that just isn't true; healing will be a big part of war. Just look at the runepriest and the zealot. Your failing to see his words as mere hype isn't my problem.
There's a write-up somewhere about how zealots are quite effective in melee. Runepriests, possibly not as much, but they still aren't the weak, easily killable clothies, and they still have offensive abilities. There's no reason why they have to only heal, other than people like you telling them to learn to play their class.



I'm telling them the role of their archtype, not how to play their class. I didn't play a warrior in wow, I played a shaman who I'd specced enh, ele, and resto at various times. I've played my fair share of dps classes as well in various games so don't try to belittle my opinion based on what you assume about me.
Ah... so you played the most overpowered class in the game.

Back to archetypes, remember that each class in an archetype is different from each other. They don't just have four classes with different names.
Oh wait, my bad... that's just more spin, as you put it. I guess every class in each archetype is exactly the same, with the exact same mechanics and abilities with just different names and looks.


If calling someone a troll isn't trolling, then I dunno.
It isn't. It's making a valid assumption. See, trolling attempts to get responses, flames, etc. Calling someone a troll tends to be used in the phrase "Don't feed the trolls", trying to get people to not flame, etc.


Also, Perp, there's really no reason to double/triple post.

[Perp]

There's a write-up somewhere about how zealots are quite effective in melee. Runepriests, possibly not as much, but they still aren't the weak, easily killable clothies, and they still have offensive abilities.

Not true. If you checked out more than one write-up about zealots you'd see this ONE guy is the anomoly and that zealots are not good in melee range. Do you actually think that zealots get (DD nukes, Dots, Hots, heals, AOE debuffs, a debuff, buffs) as caster abilities AND HE GETS TO RIP IT UP AS MELEE AS WELL? FYI, runepriest on the other hand actually have more armor than the zealot; I guess he's a melee class now as well?


Ah... so you played the most overpowered class in the game.

I don't know where you get off in thinking the shaman was the most OP class in the game. In the first year of the game; sure they were pretty tough, but they are one of the worst pvp classes right now. By the time I quit wow I'd say my warlock had become far more powerful than my shaman. The shaman was only remotely poweful in pvp if specced for resto (or elemental on 5v5's), and my rogue went from pvp ganking god to not even worth playing.

Back to archetypes, remember that each class in an archetype is different from each other. They don't just have four classes with different names.
Oh wait, my bad... that's just more spin, as you put it. I guess every class in each archetype is exactly the same, with the exact same mechanics and abilities with just different names and looks.

Your ability to comprehend my posts is lackluster.



It isn't. It's making a valid assumption. See, trolling attempts to get responses, flames, etc. Calling someone a troll tends to be used in the phrase "Don't feed the trolls", trying to get people to not flame, etc.

I think you/he are the ones trolling; I was merely offering my honest opinions.


Also, Perp, there's really no reason to double/triple post.

Mutiquoting is ghey.

All that copy/paste is a total waste of time. See above.

[Aethelbeorht]

Not true. If you checked out more than one write-up about zealots you'd see this ONE guy is the anomoly and that zealots are not good in melee range. Do you actually think that zealots get (DD nukes, Dots, Hots, heals, AOE debuffs, a debuff, buffs) as caster abilities AND HE GETS TO RIP IT UP AS MELEE AS WELL? FYI, runepriest on the other hand actually have more armor than the zealot; I guess he's a melee class now as well?

What, exactly, is "not true" about my statement? I said there's a writeup somewhere. Whether or not that guy's an anomaly, my statement still stands. The fact that you admit that there's that one guy means that my statement is true.


I don't know where you get off in thinking the shaman was the most OP class in the game. In the first year of the game; sure they were pretty tough, but they are one of the worst pvp classes right now. By the time I quit wow I'd say my warlock had become far more powerful than my shaman. The shaman was only remotely poweful in pvp if specced for resto (or elemental on 5v5's), and my rogue went from pvp ganking god to not even worth playing.

At the time I played WoW, shamans were overpowered. I stopped playing a little while back, so it wouldn't surprise me if they are no longer as powerful as they once were. No argument about your lock being OP, or your rogue being nerfed out the window. I agree with those two points.


Your ability to comprehend my posts is lackluster.

I could say the same to you. By saying that the role of every class in an archetype is the same, you're essentially saying that the classes are the same (with a bit of over exaggeration on my part, for sarcastic emphasis). The role of a WP is not exactly the same as the role of a Runepriest, the role of a swordmaster is not exactly the same as the role of a KotBS. If you want to broaden it past all recognition, sure, I guess you could make that point. But the argument is over the specifics of each class.



I think you/he are the ones trolling; I was merely offering my honest opinions.

Rather ironic statement.


Mutiquoting is ghey.

All that copy/paste is a total waste of time. See above.
The only time you have to copy/paste is if you want to split up one person's post. There's no need to copy/paste to multiquote from different people.

[Perp]

What, exactly, is "not true" about my statement? I said there's a writeup somewhere. Whether or not that guy's an anomaly, my statement still stands. The fact that you admit that there's that one guy means that my statement is true.

I've seen several people reference that guys comments as well as the one on this months podcast to back some claim that the zealot is equivalent to the warrior priest. Clearly, based on the skills reported for both the WP and Zealot that idea is entirely untrue.

Obviously each healer archtype will have some difference in playstyle, but it appears they are going to slightly mirror one another between destruction and order.

Zealot ~ Runepriest
Shaman ~ Archmage
Warrior Priest ~ DE melee/healer (I hope)



Back on topic. The WP will play and heal more like the the love child of a wow enhancement shaman and paldin. Hell the WP even has a "windfury" extra attack morale ability, and a morale stun ability (HoJ anyone?).

[Timanous]

yeah Im thinking about Zealot...they look like someone to sit back and heal.

Archmage would be for you, though they need to fight to heal.

[Perp]

Archmage would be for you, though they need to fight to heal.

Actually the best 2 for sitting back to heal is the zealot and runepriest as neither has any mechanic limiting their healing abilities.

[Crazy ol' dude]

Actually the best 2 for sitting back to heal is the zealot and runepriest as neither has any mechanic limiting their healing abilities.
Hmmm, yes, maybe.
However, i'd rather say that shaman and WP mechanics are not limiting their healing but rather boosting it. I imagine Zealot and RP's heals will be as effective as shaman and WP's without their WAAAGH/RF. But Zealot and RP have both many powerfull buffs (and debuffs in zealot case) to recompensate it.
A Zealot not debuffing and RP not buffing around is like a shaman or WP not dealing damage or archmage not draining magic. Sure, these buffs and debuffs doesn't give anything like "your heals gain +30% to power" or something, but they'll be (at least should be imo) powerfull enough that they simply don't need it.

So really if you want to sit back and heal - this game is not for you, as Mythic (thank you mythic) wants healer players to use their careers to the most, not just sit and heal all day long :)

Cheers

[heavyhebrew]

Back on topic. The WP will play and heal more like the the love child of a wow enhancement shaman and paldin. Hell the WP even has a "windfury" extra attack morale ability, and a morale stun ability (HoJ anyone?).

I think the Warrior Priest will play like a Warrior Priest on Warhammer Online and not like cookie cutter classes in some PvE game.
Also Raelimar is a very reputable poster on Only-WAR.com.
Part I of his write up is his observations on playable classes.
Zealot and Ironbreaker really stood out for him.

The write up in question is here:
Part I (http://only-war.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=16144)
Part II (http://only-war.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=16173)
Part III (http://only-war.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=16291)

I would also takes his impressions of playing the game first hand over the assumptions of someone who hasn't.

Zealot - Hands down, my favorite class not just in this game, but in any MMO from UO to date. We've all heard Mythic talk about how casters will be able to hold their own in melee, and I'm sure that like me, you've smiled politely while thinking to yourself "BS." However, 5 minutes into playing my level 21 Zealot, I had an epiphany - they're not just capable of holding their own in melee. They're bloody freaking good at it. I'm not talking about taking hits on the chin, ripping your opponents to shreds. That's far too simplistic. Zealots, on the other hand, are one of the most beautifully innovative and complex careers in recent memory. The Harbinger I was most fond of reduces all damage done by a whopping 25%. After that, I'd put down a ritual which debuffed opponents considerably. Predictably, a melee class would charge at me, and get hit with a debuff the second they entered the ritual circle. My own buff, a Mark of Chaos, boosts my fighting skills by a good amount. The speed with which I was able to drop enemies with auto-attack after my debuffs, buffs, and DoTs were stacked was pretty surprising. I barely even needed to heal. There were also some very powerful nukes (my eyes popped out of my skull when I saw the numbers on the Tier 3 morale ability for the zealot, I can't remember what it was called, but goddamn that thing was amazing), most of them in the Morale section. It's not that the Zealot is any better at melee combat than any other caster, but didn’t seem nearly as prone to interrupts. As of now, it's definitely my career of choice - hopefully Black Guard will be up to the task of luring me away once I get to try them out. If they end up being as cool as the Zealot, there's a good chance I'll be playing this game for years to come.

This player has been around since the days of the Bobs in UO. I think he has earned his credit to be taken seriously in reporting impressions of a game in development.

[Aethelbeorht]

I think the Warrior Priest will play like a Warrior Priest on Warhammer Online and not like cookie cutter classes in some PvE game.
Also Raelimar is a very reputable poster on Only-WAR.com.
Part I of his write up is his observations on playable classes.
Zealot and Ironbreaker really stood out for him.

The write up in question is here:
Part I (http://only-war.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=16144)
Part II (http://only-war.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=16173)
Part III (http://only-war.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=16291)

I would also takes his impressions of playing the game first hand over the assumptions of someone who hasn't.


I found this bit to be rather interesting, from his Q&A with the devs:

9.The Archmage was described at Leipzig as being “really good with a staff”. Does that just mean flashy casting animations, or will the Archmage be able to hold his own on the front lines?

*points at trailer* There's your Archmage.

From what I can remember of the trailer, it looks as though the archmage might not be incompetent come melee fighting.

[Volcano Mentality]

This whole debate seems to be pretty much over, but I just wanted to put in my own two cents here, seeing as Perp just didn't seem to get it.

Before I say anything, please understand I'm a bit blunt and snippy, and I might seem angry, flaming, or insulting, but I never mean it (unless I directly tell you you're an idiot or something). I've already killed a few threads because of this. Damn these boring text windows that don't let you express your tone of voice!:mad:

From what I've seen and read (which is a lot by the way, and I'm not about to list all the sources I've looked at), the Warrior Priest will be a heavily melee-oriented class, with some respectable but relatively light dps, made better through various Rightous Fury abilities. He will, however, still be a healer, which is obviously the point of aggitation in this debate.

Now, a point I absolutely MUST make is the fact that while you CAN heal straight up, it's not nearly as effective as when you use your RF for it. I know you've said it's just spin, but can you honestly prove that point with anything beyond the weight of your own opinion which, despite what you may think, isn't any more than our own, and we have developer quote backing? So, a smart WP will use his melee abilities to gain RF, then use it for DPS if no one needs healing (in group-group, this will likely be rare, but possible if the dev's decide to make battles more drawn out, or if you have another healer in the group), or use it for healing when they do.

You make a valid point about people wanting to focus fire healers, but you forget about the healer's group, or more particularly, his tank. The tank will most likely have some form of "Guard" ability like the Ironbreaker, which will redirect a percent of damage from the target to the tank, as well as possible provokes, stuns, etc. For this reason, and due to the WP having "medium armor" instead of being a clothie (no minor matter, mind you), you can reasonably survive in the melee, where you will be needed so you can improve your heals.

Additionally, while your dps input will be minor compared to the dps classes, it will still be apprectiated when the enemy and your group are both on their last legs, where even the slightest shift in your favor can decide whether you win or lose. And Paul has said (I'm going to ignore your "spin" preaching with this one, which I honestly think is BS [no offense]), all classes in the Warhammer world will have respectable dps.

I apologise if by saying what I'm about to say is "lackluster" but I have to agree with Aethel's interpretation of what you've said. You seem to think that because healers are weaklings who are best staying out of the way and healing in most games (like WoW, which has been a shining star of PvP mockery and a "Holy Warrior" fan's greatest nightmare), that they are and should be that way in all games, including this one. This is where my philosophy kicks in about wisdom in ignorance. In a few (albeit VERY few) situations, being ignorant of tradition and what is the norm can make you that much better than those who blindly follow it. If it's possible to forever banish the heal-bot from the MMO gaming world (and I honestly think it truly is possible, quite likely coming to fruition with WH, though it will likely be a bit sloppy because it's such a new idea), then I say we go for it, because there are so few people who actually like it. For those few, like the host of this thread, who actually do, give them a heal-bot class in later/other games, but lets not make it the common player's only choice if they want some healing power.

(Again, if I'm wrong about my assumptions on your opinion, please post to explain exactly what was wrong with my assumptions and clearly explain what your opinion really is; either way though, my points are still valid)

Anyways, that's all that I'm up for writing at the moment. There's a bit more, likely, I'm just to tired to think of what it is right now. G'night.

[sonofsigmar]

yup volcano, good job.thats a wrap and its done. Mythic are doing a terrific job of improving RvR and breaking down the mental barriers WoW and EQ put up (mostly WoW, the horror)

lets have our opinions, but lets keep them intelligent and let the people at Mythic design THEIR game, without going too much into what we think they should do with what is theirs.

[Paraclete]

The game isn't even out yet and you already are telling the healers how they have to play their class? (Are you by chance one of those leet wow-warriors who where charging 5 warlocks, 3 mages and a few rogues and than were complaining about not receiving enough healing love?)

In my experience (at least on my server) healers were by far the more intelligent players but it boogles my mind why still everyone thinks he must tell them how to play while the people who play dps classes are imho NOT the more skilled players.

Warhammer will really be interesting because it seems especially all the tank classes seem to have a lot of utility. And, my friend, I tell you right now that only a tank who also uses all his abilities and not just his "I am da big bad orkse boss kill kill waaagh" dps skills has a right to complain about incompetent healers.

-tear- that was beautiful. could not have been more true.

[MalakLP]

Thing is, most of support careers have to do other things than healing to be most effective...WP has to build up RP, Shaman - Waaagh and Zealot most likely will be able to power up his buffed allies by damaging debuffed enemies...that's at least what we can read in his desciption, that system is just not yet in (i think)

If you want to stand at the back and heal - i advise you to play a Runepriest. He buffs up and heals at the back and throws some AoE runes on the ground (buffs). They'll also most likely be underplayed on the release i suppose...but remember that, according to what Mythic has said, in WAR only healing around will be way less effective than using all of your career's abilities


If you want to be a below average support class, then by all means sit back and heal as a rune priest. Their best, and when i say best i mean "Clutch, fight changing, the comeback king!" skills are up close in the fight with their party. As healers, they own. But when they are really trying, they are probably one of the coolest classess in the game and although i will be a Warrior Priest as my main i most likely will be making a Rune priest and a (hopefully) White Lion of Chrace as alts. I would be highly dissapointed if there is like 1% of the population playing rune priests :(. Then again, what i saw and tried out, most people playing them are trying to hard to just heal. They are forgetting the true nature of the class, his RUNES BABY! ;). I cant wait to see some top notch players, who enjoy the support role, play this class. Ill be the first to tag along with them to support keeping my group alive to make their job a bit easier.

[MalakLP]

Actually the best 2 for sitting back to heal is the zealot and runepriest as neither has any mechanic limiting their healing abilities.

Yet another person who has no idea how the runepriest works. Someone please study up on this class, try it out at some shows, or if your in beta play it! These guys own, we need more of them! I might just have to make another healer before i try out a tank/dps ! lol

[Throwhemon]

contairy to popular belife the runepreist needs to get close to the action and doesnt just stand back and heal, he has alot of abilitys that require him to be next to his allys from the to work. his most powerful runes require him to be right in the thick of it and stay there.

[Aethelbeorht]

contairy to popular belife the runepreist needs to get close to the action and doesnt just stand back and heal, he has alot of abilitys that require him to be next to his allys from the to work. his most powerful runes require him to be right in the thick of it and stay there.

Yes, but the argument is that since he doesn't have a specific mechanic which affects his heals based on performing actions which aren't healing (such as how the WP gains RF, and the Shaman gains WAAAGH!), he's a healbot. I don't agree with that perspective, but some people on these boards (not naming any names here) are willing to argue vehemently that unless you have something which specifically requires you to do damage, (and some would argue that even with that mechanic) you're a healbot.

[Dastion]

The thing about all the healers in WAR is that if you need to stand back and spam heals then you can. I mean, if the enemy is assist training down the casters or even yourself SOMEONE needs to heal them. It has nothing to do with being a healbot, but everything to do with doing what needs to be done to win the fight. Every single one of the healer classes has a spammable heal. Yes, most of them also have offensive ways to support (War Priest has heals that require RF, but not all of them.. Goblin Shaman's heals are free if he has enough Waagh! ect..) But, the fact remains that there will be times when it is best to spam heal. Granted, WAR seems to be a game where everyone can take a hit decently, and therefore there won't be much "one shotting". But still, if a fight goes on long enough that your enemies suddenly have full Morale and your allies are having massive AoEs dropped on them, running in and whacking someone with your hammer because it's "more efficient" isn't really going to cut it when people need heals NOW. I mean, what are you going to say? "Hooray, I charged into melee combat, did three attacks(which had a setup time), and now I am able to do 1 insta-heal.. who wants it? Hey, where did everybody go?"

[Ogmios22188]

The thing about all the healers in WAR is that if you need to stand back and spam heals then you can. I mean, if the enemy is assist training down the casters or even yourself SOMEONE needs to heal them. It has nothing to do with being a healbot, but everything to do with doing what needs to be done to win the fight. Every single one of the healer classes has a spammable heal. Yes, most of them also have offensive ways to support (War Priest has heals that require RF, but not all of them.. Goblin Shaman's heals are free if he has enough Waagh! ect..) But, the fact remains that there will be times when it is best to spam heal. Granted, WAR seems to be a game where everyone can take a hit decently, and therefore there won't be much "one shotting". But still, if a fight goes on long enough that your enemies suddenly have full Morale and your allies are having massive AoEs dropped on them, running in and whacking someone with your hammer because it's "more efficient" isn't really going to cut it when people need heals NOW. I mean, what are you going to say? "Hooray, I charged into melee combat, did three attacks(which had a setup time), and now I am able to do 1 insta-heal.. who wants it? Hey, where did everybody go?"
I don't think the Warrior Priest has heals that don't require Righteous Fury, though I could be wrong.

[Loekii]

I don't think the Warrior Priest has heals that don't require Righteous Fury, though I could be wrong.

I think WP is a venture in making Healing more attractive to those players that tended to avoid it. A Melee healer, if done properly, will attract a lot of non-healers into playing/dabbling with Healing, and maybe fill the ranks of this necessary role.

[tzeencz]

I don't think the Warrior Priest has heals that don't require Righteous Fury, though I could be wrong.

Heals don`t need RF in order to cast them, however with RF those spells drastically increase their effectiveness.

[Ogmios22188]

Heals don`t need RF in order to cast them, however with RF those spells drastically increase their effectiveness.
Yeah, that's what I meant to say. There'd be no reason really to encourage the Warrior Priest in your group to stand back and spam heals, because they would suck.

[Dastion]

Every healer in Warhammer has a basic heal. Yes, for some classes (especially Shaman), doing damage makes your heals more effective in some way (I believe it was said that a Shaman, Waagh! substitutes for the AP cost and with enough of it you can cast heals at 0 AP).

There will be times for that Shaman when him, or an ally, are getting focus fired by 3 bright wizards and efficiency goes out the window..because being dead with a full AP bar is about as inefficient as you can get in a fight. He will have to stand there and spam heal himself or his ally and hope that by delaying the damage dealt that his partner can slowly pick off the Bright Wizards, who likely have very little in the way of healing capabilities.

Playing your class based on the situation means being a good player, it doesn't make you a heal bot.

[Der_Eisenhans]

Playing your class based on the situation means being a good player, it doesn't make you a heal bot.

Exactly. And that's what most of us will do.
Will be hard, though, because we're always in the thick of things. Ah, well practice makes perfect.

[LightI3ulb]

Heals don`t need RF in order to cast them, however with RF those spells drastically increase their effectiveness.

Incorrect.

[Jonas]

Incorrect.

Actually, according to the latest movie that I have seen on the matter, it is you who is incorrect and the subject of your quote who is correct.

If you have recent evidence to dispute this, I would of course appreciate that. But to the best of my knowledge, in the latest build being used at gamesdays (which quite possibly could have changed in beta), Mr Tzeencz is right on the money.

[Dastion]

From what I've heard on Warrior-Priests neither of them are really correct, though the ignorant one saying "Incorrect" is probably the most off.. do you really think they'd force the class who's role is healing to melee in order to even cast a heal? Really? So what are they supposed to do when you're getting focus fired by a bunch of magus? Charge across the field to melee with them so they can run back to heal you? lol. WP do have at least one basic heal that they can spam if they choose, however, they will also have heals that require them to melee and possibly some that simply use RF to boost the effect. Just like all of the other healing classes with a damage point mechanic they are most efficient if they can do both.. but there are times when sh*t hits the fan and someone being dead is way less efficient than spamming a heal.

[Dastion]

I don't think the Warrior Priest has heals that don't require Righteous Fury, though I could be wrong.

Yeah, that's what I meant to say. There'd be no reason really to encourage the Warrior Priest in your group to stand back and spam heals, because they would suck.

Check out this video,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vYEl4Gu38c0&NR=1

As you can see, the Warrior Priest spends a lot of time both meleeing and spamming heals, he's mixing it up to be effective. Sometimes someone is getting owned and it's better for him to spam heals. What kinda of excuse is, "but that's less efficient!" when the tank asks you why you were whacking away with your hammer instead of healing him while he had the 3 dps on him? However, if you look at around 5:20-5:40, you'll see the Warrior Priest with 5 Righteous Fury (seems to be the max) use up 4 of it to instantly heal himself for a hefty chunk, so this means that it is still possible for you to be up there meleeing and quickly switch targets to heal someone. Seeing as how the ability is greyed out unless he has Righteous Fury (in which case it starts to flame around the edges like many of the attacks he seems to be using that consume RF).

I also don't see where his main heal is using any of his RF whenever he casts a spell, but I do notice what seems to be a debuff or buff of some sort when he gains RF, I didn't play a WP at any of the gamesday events, but from what i hear that's your "timer" before your RF burns off.

[WandaNoColossus]

Will RF vanish if not used? Is there any timer or something like that?

BTW: Where can i see the RF-(Bar) on the UI?? Cant find it:(

[Megha]

In the video that Dastion posted, RF is indicated by the green number in the bottom right of the screen, specifically, between the mini map and action bar.

From the videos I've seen if you aren't in combat for a period of time, you lose all the RF you had accumulated (it happens in the video at the 3:39 mark).

[ChosenOne]

I would imagine it should diminish if you are out of combat for long. We cant have crazy warrior priests stalking the land looking to smash someone because their enemy died too soon....

[Megha]

Fair enough but the all or nothing decay seems a little broken and tbh it could be abused easily.