Skill or Equipment??

[rokema]

what would you guys like that would decide a battle?
skill?
Equipment?
Both?
I like blue.. NOO YYEEEeelllooooooowwww

[Slash]

I voted a mix of both. Obviously people will need skill, and the way WAR is shaping up you will definitely need to be a lot more tactical then in some other MMO's, and I hope/believe that mythic will focus the game more on skill rather on gear. However, gear will without a doubt have an impact on the player.

[rokema]

C'mon guys!
Tell your thoughts! and ty Slash for your comment!
_______________________
Choppa's da best because...
We die Choppin'!

[Mortimus]

A player should never be life support for items that win battles for them.

Like a lot of players out there I have been-there, done-that and bought the t-shirt when it comes to the MMO items arm race...usually because I have no choice in the matter if I want to be competative.

I think its safe to say that there are few things lamer than being schooled in pvp by someone with obviously inferior skill but vastly superior weapons and items.

Skill should always trump items.
Always.

[Grimfell Gromgear]

We are in need of a MPHGMMO A Monty Python and the Holy Grail Massively Multiplayer game... to be precise.

I'd roll a peasent, focus on the dung harvesting profession.

[Gorrr]

what would you guys like that would decide a battle?
skill?
Equipment?
Both?
I like blue.. NOO YYEEEeelllooooooowwww
define skill.

[Splitty]

MMO's as a general rule are loot based. Thats the time sink factor, play more to win more to play more.
I would personally like to see no loot, or extremely available loot with a wide variety of loot available which is equal in "power".

[Grimfell Gromgear]

MMO's as a general rule are loot based. Thats the time sink factor, play more to win more to play more.
I would personally like to see no loot, or extremely available loot with a wide variety of loot available which is equal in "power".

While such systems sound good in theory, it's hard to entice a playerbase to stay with a game for a year that they have to continue paying for when they don't have a definite statistical advantage over people who haven't put in the time that they have.

Grind and loot provide a buffer that justifies the long life cycles of MMO's to most players.

[Arctos]

First off I think this would be better in General Discussion over Greenskin's but thats aside the OP question.

Gear should have some factor but not be the deciding factor, if they guy on the other end has awesome gear and is just mashing buttons he should still loose to someone who thinks about it, and knows thier class and skills, and the oppoents weakness.

[Feigro]

I'd roll a peasent, focus on the dung harvesting profession.

Man I'd definitely roll one of those guys that hits themselves in the face with those books whilst chanting.

"ohmmmmmm"

ClUNCK


As to the topic at hand, Gear to me is just an icon. It's essentially no different then lifting weights. You lift weights, you gain some strength... Hey, you kill a Dragon, you gained some strength. The only difference is people like tangable stuff. Adam Gersh said it best when they redid how skills were distributed - they apparently had it down to a science where you'd get some sort of advancement almost by the hour, but then "maan... I didn't get anything when I leveled..." . So when you kill that Dragon, you're getting an item, you put it on, and your strength is higher than before.

Naturally, I would assume a veteran dragon hunter is more skilled in battle than a squire just turned Knight. So this is displayed through your character. There's a mechanic to display that difference of characters in place. It doesn't solely rely on the skill of the player.

So basically, in short, It should be both. But I wouldn't limit it to gear per se, I'd say it should be a mix of the Attributes and abilities indicated by your character (i.e the advancement it's gone through in the last year) coupled with the skill and knowledge of the game itself by the player.

[rokema]

We are in need of a MPHGMMO A Monty Python and the Holy Grail Massively Multiplayer game... to be precise.

I'd roll a peasent, focus on the dung harvesting profession.
Ur so right! m8!
(now back on the topic pls)

I see skill as: lets take an example from wow twinks m'kay?
They only have to spamm 1 power and an enamie is dead!
Skill = Having a tactic and not just running around killing people within 1 hit...
________________________
Choppa's da bezst because...
We diez Choppin'!

[Kridak]

skill.

10 character min

[WastedTrojan]

Skill should be the #1 factor in determining a fight. Gear should have something to do with it but not nearly to the extent WoW put high end gear.

[Arbedark]

MMO's as a general rule are loot based. Thats the time sink factor, play more to win more to play more.
I would personally like to see no loot, or extremely available loot with a wide variety of loot available which is equal in "power".

Go play City of Heroes / City of Villains...

[Roargh]

there should be some statistics cap that would make a difference of something like 10 to 25% difference at max tier/rank.
Skill should be the deciding factor ofcourse in kicking some .
And the loot should be more about looking cool, then being uber.

[Axxar]

Skill should definetly matter the most. Equipment should only provide a smaller boost compared to skill - people shouldn't win at games they're crap at playing.

[rokema]

Yeah and it would cut out the gold buyers!
most people buy gold to buy gear, so if gear isnt that important there wil be less of those buyers!
________________________
Choppa's da bezst because...
We diez Choppin'!

[Axxar]

Another feather in the hat for skill-based gameplay. I'll have to remember that one.

[Timmymtd]

I said all equipment.

[Peemja]

I think both.
Of course I want it to be most skills, but in order to make PvP more fun, is if you can buy rewards for RvR points (or whatever its called.) and get cool and better equipment.
I dont know how the reward system in WAR works tho (if there even is one:p)

[Sloane]

Definitely a mix of both. I believe that a player should be rewarded for his/her hard work with gabbing some good gear, but also must show that they can hold their own in situations.

[rokema]

I said all equipment.
please say why! we would like to know comments from all sides!
________________________
Choppa's da bezst because...
We diez choppin'!

[Feigro]

I'm gonna rehash my initial post with what I feel was a much better post at getting my point across. I posted this over at WAR-RvR for a similiar subject;

A comprimise needs to be met. +Stat bonuses are implemented to indicate the advancement of the character. If Lord Bubbleberry slays dragons for 50 years, he's naturally going to be a bit more Skilled than a squire just turned Knight (assuming, as is the case in any game, Aging isn't a factor). That's where stats and levels shine.

The deal is, it needs to be balanced where stats don't overpower the actual skill of the person who's playing lord Bubbleberry. A good parallel is the fighting game. Occasionally you get these "cheese" characters that'll rule the game simply because of the combos they can pull off regardless if the skill of the player in control. The absolute best example I can think of off the top of my head is E. Honda's Hundred Hand Slap in Street Fighter. It didn't matter if you were a vet or a noob, if you got put in a corner by that thing, it was usually luck that got you out of it. Likewise, veteran or noob, all you had to do was mash 1 button and off you go.

Anyway, back to RPGs. You need to strike balance between the natural progression of the character, but (like the fighting game) don't overpower the mechanics of the character so that the players actions are trivialized while still resulting in victory. Player skill should always be important and accounted for. But it should also be remembered that we're playing characters. Just like picking E. Honda over Guile, there are differentiating features. These are further extended because RPGs allow the character templates to progress. So it'd be like if you selected Guile, but were allowed to train for every fight, lift weights, etc. Naturally, if you trained for a year, you'd be stronger than any other newer Guile (someone with the same character template) that entered the ring with you. But as I mentioned, this Character skill should never overshadow Player Skill.

[rokema]

there should be some statistics cap that would make a difference of something like 10 to 25% difference at max tier/rank.
Skill should be the deciding factor ofcourse in kicking some .
And the loot should be more about looking cool, then being uber.
I agree
________________________
Choppa's da bezst because...
We diez choppin'!

[Accipiter]

I voted skill.

Although I don't mind some advantages from equipment as long as I don't have to do #@!%*& 40-man PvE raids several nights a week to get the *%$# gear.

I'd say something like a ratio of 80% skill to 20% gear with all the gear obtainable through RvR.

[minigoose]

When i played WoW i had skill, not really that great of armor, and when i was in PvP i shined. I had the top dmg, and top 3 HK's out of anyone else (ussualy) i mean there were times where i wasnt really paying attention. SO skill in my book. To be good all you need is skill, to be great its 75% skill 25% armor 100% ally help.

[Axxar]

In my experience top kills/dmg in WoW BGs was usually achieved by people being useless in an eternal fight over some pointless part of the BG and stealing killing blows.

[Dracallo]

You could be skilled to the max and have BS armor and get stomped... you could also say the same thing for someone with armor but no decent weapon/skill.

I said 50/50

[rokema]

when i was with my wow hunt in bg i was always top 3 eventhough i died in a few shots by a full epic
________________________
Choppa's da bezst because...
We diez Choppin'!

[kamigorosh]

When i played WoW i had skill, not really that great of armor, and when i was in PvP i shined. I had the top dmg, and top 3 HK's out of anyone else (ussualy) i mean there were times where i wasnt really paying attention. SO skill in my book. To be good all you need is skill, to be great its 75% skill 25% armor 100% ally help.

lol......thats funny anyways i would think it should work like it did for daoc pre Toa. Finding the drops for your templates and getting that one uber drop was always fun for me.Maybe am getting off topic but over all i say skill 75% armor 25%

[pooter26]

The gear in WoW gave way too many stats. What most games underestimate is that people with good gear are typically more skilede anyway because they have played the game longer and learned more. This is not the case all the time, but i can guarantee you 90% of the time someone with really good gear is not a noob.

I vote 30% gear 70% skill meaning 70% of the time if someone has better gear than you, you will win if you have more skill.

[rokema]

in PVP you need skill but if you only have to press one button to kill a whole group its overpowered like twinks in wow:O.... look, some peeps are skillful in GROUPING some are skillfull in PVP theres a difference.
________________________
Choppa's da bezst because...
We diez Choppin'!

[Archangel-WHA]

Moving to New Player Q&A. It doesn't really belong in Greenskin Discussion.

I bring you change