High Elves may have it the worst

[Earth Dragon]

I hate to say it, but this may be the most unbalanced pairing of the three. We constantly see more people in the DE forums, as much as 10x the amount. Paul pushes for Dark Elves every time you hear the guy speak. Being evil is becoming a fad. Not to mention all the perverts and girls who will be playing witch elves.

The masses of kiddies may change this once it is released, but do you think they will really be helping the war effort? Many of the players who just want to do PvE with minor PvP choose the good guys. So you are going to have to have more, just to field enough people actually willing to defend the territory with any form of brass. And I don't think the High Elves are going to have more.

[Earth Dragon]

Oh yeah. One more thing. I will come over and help if this turns out to be the case for you fellas :cool:. Who doesn't want a Warrior Priest on the front lines?

[Freax]

Dont worry, when the game comes out and all the kids and legolas wannabes start playing, it will be no problem.

[dutch_gamer]

More posts in the DE forums means absolutely nothing when it comes to balance of the pairing. There is far more to discuss on the DE forums than on this one. It is not so hard to guess the careers and that leaves not much to discuss. Also, this is a forum for the hardcore, as it usually is before release of a game, and they are drawn more towards the "evil" side.

I don't see an issue when it comes to the balance between HE and DE. This game isn't about balance between two races but about the balance between the two realms. Most people who will play this game will pick one particular battlefront over the other. Also, most people will more than likely level up together with a mixture of the 3 races per side. It seems you even answered your own concern in a reply to your own post.

The reason why I am not buying the fact that people playing the good guys will mostly be doing PvE, is that this game is not a PvE game, but RvR. Another reason is, there is no real good and evil in Warhammer. And as you so eloquently put, "the perverts and girls" will be playing Witch Elves. If the only reason people pick a class is to look sexy, I don't expect them to be that good at PvP anyway. With other words, even though the "evil" side attracts the hardcore it will also attract it is fair share of not so great PvPers, because of careers such as the Witch Elf. My guess is that the Dwarfs and Greenskins will probably have the best players. The smaller the following of a race, the more tight knit the players will be. And that is what is needed to do well in RvR.

[Pseudoman]

I was about to post the same thing as Freax. Once they release more info on the Elven archer class I think you will see alot more activity.

[Exemplari]

I'm not particularly worried about a disparity between Dark and High Elves.. If it happens, then it happens; I'll still enjoy the game thoroughly as I'm sure other high elf players will. It might even make defending Ulthuan all that much more fun if there is an imbalance.

[wellsy]

Imbalance against the HE? Oh please. As soon as we get the Logolassies (delioberately mispelt), the Drizzt wannabees will be overwhelmed.

And as for all the perverts and girls playing Witch Elves... well, we all know that Witch Elves make for very, er, attractive targets.

:D

[Loekii]

Imbalance against the HE? Oh please. As soon as we get the Logolassies (delioberately mispelt), the Drizzt wannabees will be overwhelmed.

And as for all the perverts and girls playing Witch Elves... well, we all know that Witch Elves make for very, er, attractive targets.

:D

Joking aside, I do think there is some merit in the prediction that Mythic might be in danger of actually 'gimping' DEs by making them attractable to the lessor quality players.

To clarify, that is not to say someone that wants to play a WE or even a DE character is lessor quality, but rather that those types of toons attract the lessor quality players.

For example, there might be 5000 Dark Elves on a server, with the vast majority of them being poor players.

Or it could simply be 5000 good players.

Oh, and to add, I think there is also the motivating factor of the desire to kick DE butts, that might bring over some fellow Dwarf and Empire players to aid on the HE/DE front. :D

[Captbigbeard]

Dude these forums represent such a small amount of the over all player base (hopefully because that would imply the game is good). Humans and high elves will be the most popular race, just like they are in any MMO. I don't see Warhammer breaking the trend.

That said, the elf community can't match the awesomeness of the dwarf community ;). We may have far less players, but their not your preteen legolas lovers.

[Loekii]

I am not too sure.

Are not Dark Elves in other games pretty popular? Add to that if the remaining Dark Elf classes are considered some of the more 'cool' classes in WAr.

I can certainly see such things taking away from HE and even Human players.

However, I am not too worried about population counts, so long as there are enough players on both sides to make it enjoyable.

Heck, I am willing to bet that there will be some pretty good players and battles brought about by the 'under populated' races.

[Captbigbeard]

To be honest, I disagree with your prediction... but I sure as hell hope your right! ;)

[Earth Dragon]

Dude these forums represent such a small amount of the over all player base (hopefully because that would imply the game is good). Humans and high elves will be the most popular race, just like they are in any MMO. I don't see Warhammer breaking the trend.

That said, the elf community can't match the awesomeness of the dwarf community ;). We may have far less players, but their not your preteen legolas lovers.
People see elves as elves half the time. People who played Blood Elves in WoW will most likely be playing Dark Elves for the "bad guy" thing. There are no wood elves, so your legolas wanna-bes might be splitting between the two. There are elves on BOTH sides to start, and I feel many of the "vet" players from another game will be defaulting bad side. Reasoning? This is WAR. It's going to bring out the "dark" side of people, and they will want to play the "dark" side. We haven't even mentioned all the emo freaks that will play a dark elf.

Yes elves are more popular then dwarves, but there are TWO elf teams, and only one dwarf. I just see people taking this "change of pace" as just that, and the bad guys will have a good chance to out number the those playing order.

[Earth Dragon]

Heck, I am willing to bet that there will be some pretty good players and battles brought about by the 'under populated' races.
I agree with this, but am still a little weary.

Many times the reason why the low pop teams in games can pull off the victories is because they are the "evil" or "bad" guys, and thus attract a more aggresive and competetive crowd. The same sissies playing the good guys in other games will continue to play them in WAR if they pick it up, and if they are lacking in troops, those pansies won't help, or won't care enough to really learn WTF is going on.

I could be wrong though. I have to remember there is the minority of players that choose to play the underdog just so they have more fun. So they will be even out the playing field regardless.

[ChosenOne]

Well I have been a chosen follower from the first day I layed eyes on this game. I bet most of the dark elf followers have been the same. But as the High Elves have begun to be shown to us I have begun to become a fan. I already know that on my Order server High Elves will definately be my choice and I am an elf hater.

I'm just worried that archmages and shadow warriors will be so much damn fun that I will begin to ignore my Chosen. Even their tanks the swordmasters seem interesting to play.

[WarMachine]

Well I have been a chosen follower from the first day I layed eyes on this game. I bet most of the dark elf followers have been the same. But as the High Elves have begun to be shown to us I have begun to become a fan. I already know that on my Order server High Elves will definately be my choice and I am an elf hater.

I'm just worried that archmages and shadow warriors will be so much damn fun that I will begin to ignore my Chosen. Even their tanks the swordmasters seem interesting to play.
QFT

Although I don't know if i'll ever be tempted enough to drop the Chosen as my main, but the Swordmaster will be my second 40 for sure.

[Screwhealz]

With Shadow Warriors and White Lions very likely being the next two classes for the HE I dont see us having any problems with ratio of HE : DE. I'm gonna be an archamge most likely but I know that right now if there are white lions he will be on of those, and i feel many others r also waiting for one of these two classes. There is no way I see HE having a low pop with all the amazing classes they have (assuming the next 2 are Shadow Warriors and White Lions). And even if we are a bit low...who doesnt love to be the underdog?

[Blaze]

Well I have been a chosen follower from the first day I layed eyes on this game. I bet most of the dark elf followers have been the same. But as the High Elves have begun to be shown to us I have begun to become a fan. I already know that on my Order server High Elves will definately be my choice and I am an elf hater.

I'm just worried that archmages and shadow warriors will be so much damn fun that I will begin to ignore my Chosen. Even their tanks the swordmasters seem interesting to play.

Before the classes were announced I was pretty sure the High Elves would be the least interesting race for me. Since I first browsed some old HE army book I had always found their clean white and blue look ugly, their pompous decorative armor ridiculous and their overall cuture annoying in it's arrogance.

So who would have thought that I would be so impressed by what Mythic did for them in this game I'm almost certain a Swordmaster will be one of my main alts. I fully expected DE to be awesome, so it didn't come as a surprise that they rocked my socks off, but the High Elves might be their best work. They were possibly the hardest race to get right. Their look actually manages to be both regal and cool, something I thought impossible considering my usual taste.

To sum it up: Good Job Mythic!

[Earth Dragon]

I can't find these "white lions." Does anyone have a pic?

Edit: Had to look at the UK stuff. Found them. Elves with axes huh.

[Blaze]

I can't find these "white lions." Does anyone have a pic?

http://uk.games-workshop.com/highelves/miniature-gallery/13/

The White Lions are the personal guard of the Phoenix King. They form a number of substantial regiments that protect the King's palace in peacetime and accompany him in time of war. Traditionally the White Lions are recruited from the rugged land of Chrace, a perilous realm whose inhabitants are great woodsmen and fierce warriors. Those woodsman of Chrace who prove themselves worthy to become a member of the King's elite bodyguard are expert warriors, who fight with long-handled axes. Shoulder to shoulder with their comrades, White Lions are capable of weathering the deadliest assaults before retaliating with swift, crushing blows.

White Lion regiments are often despatched to join the armies of Ulthuan during times of particular danger, tasked with protecting High Elf generals, mages or bolstering the overall strength of the army. White Lions are renowned for their unflinching courage in the face of overwhelming odds and terrible horrors, protecting their charge whatever the foe and regardless of the danger to themselves.

Macho hillbilly elves. Exept they are a lot cooler than that would imply. Possible lion pet, elf that is not a nancy, big axe etc.

EDIT: Oh I was too slow :(

[Earth Dragon]

But so much appreciated. That's the kind of stuff that makes people stick around with a game:p

[Barundin162]

Yes White Lions may possibly be the MDPS, but I personally doubt they will have a pet. If anyone not yet uncovered it will be a DE Beastmaster..?

Anyways I find WLs to be very unique. Elves with Axes....its certainly original to say the least. (Plus the new TT Model of them on a Chariot pulled by Lions is just TOPS) but between the two I find SM to be more interesting personally....though if they do have a pet...mmmm

[Earth Dragon]

SMs? What are those?

And yeah. If they have White Lions, from what I see of them, that would be a premo alt. But I would still want that Warrior Priest. Just thinking of the guy is making me want to play a Paladin w/ a hammer.

Edit: Swordmasters of Hoeth. got it.

I believe the White Lions would be awesome. Very flavorful, and would set up a career/style of Elf that has never been seen before. Nice change for your typical sword and bow elf, with the occasional polearm.

[Zunjin]

Even as much Im lurking at the dark elf forums at the moment, the chances are still 50 / 50 whichever I will be playing dark elf or high elf. It will all depend on the moment.

[Estebar]

I hate to say it, but this may be the most unbalanced pairing of the three. We constantly see more people in the DE forums, as much as 10x the amount. Paul pushes for Dark Elves every time you hear the guy speak. Being evil is becoming a fad. As people have said, there's always been more action in the DE forums because the possibilities for their classes aren't so clear. First, there was the huge debate over who was going to be the DE Melee DPS class, because the army has so many melee-concentrated options, and now it's all about who could possibly be the DE Healer/Support class for the exact opposite reason: there aren't any support-concentrated units in the DE army. Even the Sorceress is a selfish cow who only heals herself (though she is the best candidate at the moment).

I, myself, was more interested in playing Dark Elves for a long while, because as people have said, Games Workshop High Elves seem a little bland, clean-cut and vanilla white. But, with Mythic's reinvention of their image somewhat, fleshing them out a little, and with the new upcoming army book released in a few weeks, that shouldn't be a problem. Personally, I changed my mind and decided to play High Elves because of my outrage in their using Avelorn as the Tier 3 Dark Elf zone, which I'm sure was partially behind the games developers' reasoning for doing it - hitting High Elf fans where it hurts by giving their one nature-based paradise area to their enemies...or just to publically make a statement that they hate LOTR tree-hugging Elves and their prancing fairytale goodness and want High Elves to have nothing to do with it.

Also, remember that Paul admitted that despite his previous resentment towards the HE, he is very tempted to play a Swordmaster and at Leipzig, he was very keen on emphasising the British vs. American civil war similarity with the HE vs. DE setting, obviously partly because of his partnership with Jeff Hickman - an American. Spo perhaps with these ideas of white lion pets running around (the lion being a common symbol for England) there might be a slight hint of Barnett's national pride coming through?

We'll have to see tomorrow when they reveal the new class!

[Speedy]

Well I have been a chosen follower from the first day I layed eyes on this game. I bet most of the dark elf followers have been the same. But as the High Elves have begun to be shown to us I have begun to become a fan. I already know that on my Order server High Elves will definately be my choice and I am an elf hater.

I'm just worried that archmages and shadow warriors will be so much damn fun that I will begin to ignore my Chosen. Even their tanks the swordmasters seem interesting to play.

Got me there! Even before they announced the classes, I fell in love with the Dark elves at first glance, and when the two classes were announced, that just cinched it for me.

I actually am gonna have that same problem! Because I want to roll a Warrior Priest(I love pallies, flame me :P) or a HE if swordmasters continue to look amazing. But hopefully, my guildies will keep me on the Destruction server =D

[Estebar]

I'm just worried that archmages and shadow warriors will be so much damn fun that I will begin to ignore my Chosen. Even their tanks the swordmasters seem interesting to play. I know what you mean. At the moment, I don't know which class I'm gonna play more - the Zealot or the White Lion. I'm caught between the two.

[Crusader]

I see Black Guards as being an overpopulated career. I don't see DEs themselves being overplayed unless possibly Shades are introduced.

I think High Elves will be more impressive in-game and will develop their following more there.

[Droogie]

Well I have been a chosen follower from the first day I layed eyes on this game. I bet most of the dark elf followers have been the same. But as the High Elves have begun to be shown to us I have begun to become a fan. I already know that on my Order server High Elves will definately be my choice and I am an elf hater.

I'm just worried that archmages and shadow warriors will be so much damn fun that I will begin to ignore my Chosen. Even their tanks the swordmasters seem interesting to play.


Agree as well. I was so set on playing an Orc Choppa/Destruction in general, but once I have laid eyes on the Swordmaster and Witchhunter, I am pretty certain those will be my first two chars, with maybe a small bit of Choppa on the side.

[Theomega]

Though Destruction has some very appealing classes, I'm going Order regardless and the more I watch the Swordmaster presentation video (the one that shows him in game), the more tempted I am to roll one as my main.

I too hope the game isn't grossly unbalanced due to population. Though, I don't mind being the underdog by a slight margin, it adds challenge.

[Noesis]

I hate to say it, but this may be the most unbalanced pairing of the three. We constantly see more people in the DE forums, as much as 10x the amount. Paul pushes for Dark Elves every time you hear the guy speak. Being evil is becoming a fad. Not to mention all the perverts and girls who will be playing witch elves.

The masses of kiddies may change this once it is released, but do you think they will really be helping the war effort? Many of the players who just want to do PvE with minor PvP choose the good guys. So you are going to have to have more, just to field enough people actually willing to defend the territory with any form of brass. And I don't think the High Elves are going to have more.

The main argument against this is that this forum does not represent the overall gamer base. This is a fundamentally flawed argument. Are the people who browse these forums aliens from another planet? No, they are human beings like the rest of us that share similar thoughts and opinions on what is "cool" and what isn't. As I have already mentioned, we can assume that many people who join the game after release should share vaguely similar ideas on what is cool. Therefore the overall disparity between good and evil will remain relatively the same with a slight margin of error. Especially when one considers that there currently exists a 4-1 evil to good, and sometimes 8-1 Dark Elf to High Elf disparity. This shows a dramatic affinity for the "evil" classes that will absorb any slight change in trends from the new population of gamers that join post-release.

I should also mention that one of the main reasons for this disparity is that the good guys have nothing which really distinguishes them from the evil guys that has traditionally attracted many gamers to the side of good in the past. Evil has elves and good has Elves. Elves have traditionally been a powerful attraction to the side of good, yet both sides have them.

Evil will most certainly outbalance good at release.

[wellsy]

The main argument against this is that this forum does not represent the overall gamer base. This is a fundamentally flawed argument. Are the people who browse these forums aliens from another planet? No, they are human beings like the rest of us that share similar thoughts and opinions on what is "cool" and what isn't. As I have already mentioned, we can assume that many people who join the game after release should share vaguely similar ideas on what is cool. Therefore the overall disparity between good and evil will remain relatively the same with a slight margin of error. Especially when one considers that there currently exists a 4-1 evil to good, and sometimes 8-1 Dark Elf to High Elf disparity. This shows a dramatic affinity for the "evil" classes that will absorb any slight change in trends from the new population of gamers that join post-release.

I should also mention that one of the main reasons for this disparity is that the good guys have nothing which really distinguishes them from the evil guys that has traditionally attracted many gamers to the side of good in the past. Evil has elves and good has Elves. Elves have traditionally been a powerful attraction to the side of good, yet both sides have them.

Evil will most certainly outbalance good at release.

And what about the simple fact that most of the activity in the DE forum is due to the controversy raging about the next two classes; controversy that is almost completely lacking in the HE forums?

Simply put, HE know what we're getting, we've settled on to it, and we're happy about it. DE being DE, they're backstabbing and arguing over everything.

Besides, being the underdog is fun, attractive targets aside.

[Fusko]

I hate to say it, but this may be the most unbalanced pairing of the three. We constantly see more people in the DE forums, as much as 10x the amount.

Its because of all the bloodnoob topics. Right now theres 5 people looking at the DE forums, and 4 at the HE. We can't really say which side will be more populated. :-/

[checkthis5000]

I hate to say it, but this may be the most unbalanced pairing of the three. We constantly see more people in the DE forums, as much as 10x the amount. Paul pushes for Dark Elves every time you hear the guy speak. Being evil is becoming a fad. Not to mention all the perverts and girls who will be playing witch elves.

The masses of kiddies may change this once it is released, but do you think they will really be helping the war effort? Many of the players who just want to do PvE with minor PvP choose the good guys. So you are going to have to have more, just to field enough people actually willing to defend the territory with any form of brass. And I don't think the High Elves are going to have more.

I just wanted to underline/bold/italics that one word......

Throughout all of RPG history, being evil has been and always will be a fad.

The good guys are never "cool." It's always the evil ones that have the kickass armor and mean looking weapons.

That being said, I dont think you can tell a race's popularity by the amount of traffic it's section of the forum gets.

You can, however, tell which race has just had a controversial announcement.

If only we could go back in time and check out the dwarf forum when "No slayers" was announced, or the Chaos forum when "No female Chosen or Marauders" was announced.

I personally think the High Elves are going to be one of the most artistically impressive races, and I think that will draw a huge crowd.

I think the staunch followings for each race in the Warhammer world are pretty equal. I'm just hoping that all translates into the MMO better than people would guess.

[Estebar]

You tend to find the good-aligned characters, those on Order, have a greater longevity.

This is because all the pre-teen "awesome-mongers" tend to have the same attention span and sense of commitment as a horsefly.

This is also because, being bad is great and all, but people tend to find the end goal more appealing as a good guy. Destroying the world, bringing suffering and eternal darkness, warping everything into wriggly tentacles, ending happiness, covering every ince of the earth in flaming debris...these things all sound great when you're a bad guy, and you have a lot of fun saying that you want this to happen, but in the end, something inherent in the human race wants everything to work out alright in the end. I think it's tied to our own personal sense of mortality. At the end of our lives, we want happiness, not suffering.

Plus, it's a lot more difficult to achieve different dimensions in an evil character. Most people tend to get bored of being big and spikey and going "BWA HA HA" all the time, so unless their villain suddenly starts missing his parents he ate, or rediscovers an old twin brother or girlfriend or something, they usually drop him and go onto something else.

These are a few reasons why the good guys will end up on top.

[Chielz0r]

I never get tired of BWA HA HA!

[Lord Tareq]

At the end of our lives, we want happiness, not suffering.Now you are not giving evil characters enough credit, they don't want suffering for themselves, just for everyone else so they can be even more happy then a so-called good hero.
I mean, what is better then growing old with a beautiful wife and a few kids while living in a nice mansion with a big garden? Well this is for starters: Growing old with a beautiful wife and a few kids while living in a nice mansion with a big garden with an army of slaves that do everything slightly unpleasant for you!

[Barundin162]

This is also because, being bad is great and all, but people tend to find the end goal more appealing as a good guy. Destroying the world, bringing suffering and eternal darkness, warping everything into wriggly tentacles, ending happiness, covering every ince of the earth in flaming debris...these things all sound great when you're a bad guy, and you have a lot of fun saying that you want this to happen, but in the end, something inherent in the human race wants everything to work out alright in the end. I think it's tied to our own personal sense of mortality. At the end of our lives, we want happiness, not suffering.

Plus, it's a lot more difficult to achieve different dimensions in an evil character. Most people tend to get bored of being big and spikey and going "BWA HA HA" all the time, so unless their villain suddenly starts missing his parents he ate, or rediscovers an old twin brother or girlfriend or something, they usually drop him and go onto something else.

These are a few reasons why the good guys will end up on top.

I think its more of a "What Next" thing.

Ok picture this, the Empire has been enslaved, the Dwarf Holds are in ruins, and Ulthuan has been captured (and thuss it sinks due to the power matrix holding it up no longer being supported cause the DE couldnt care less)...ok then yall can go invade Bretonnia and burn Athel Loren...then you might as well go capture Lustia...well know Cathay is all like still alive so you gotta go invade that as well.....ok now the world is in your hands, congrats your the biggest bad A in the world.

So what now...now you got a million other bad As wanna be's that wanna usurp you and no more goodie two shoes to fight against.

Its just so boring....hence why grimgor didnt kill Archon, cause then he couldnt fight him some more.

[Lucrece]

I think its more of a "What Next" thing.

Ok picture this, the Empire has been enslaved, the Dwarf Holds are in ruins, and Ulthuan has been captured (and thuss it sinks due to the power matrix holding it up no longer being supported cause the DE couldnt care less)...ok then yall can go invade Bretonnia and burn Athel Loren...then you might as well go capture Lustia...well know Cathay is all like still alive so you gotta go invade that as well.....ok now the world is in your hands, congrats your the biggest bad A in the world.

So what now...now you got a million other bad As wanna be's that wanna usurp you and no more goodie two shoes to fight against.

Its just so boring....hence why grimgor didnt kill Archon, cause then he couldnt fight him some more.

Nobody can conquer Lustria. As soon as the Slann find some particular race as interfering with the Old Ones' plans, that particular race will be erased perfunctorily.

Slann>All!

[wellsy]

I never get tired of BWA HA HA!

What about KYA HA HA, or GYA HA HA?

Yes, I have been playing too much FFVII.

[ChosenOne]

Now now, the Order isnt all goodie goodies. The Empire......its all in the name folks. See all the skulls on their armor? They still seek domination, but ordered domination not destruction.

The High Elves? Yeah you cant convince me that they wouldnt love to be in charge of everyone. I mean, who better then themselves right? The world would be great then. :D

The Dwarves? Well if they ruled the world it would be much more productive so who better then a dwarf right?

Thats why I like the "good" side in this game. Its not about being goodie goodie, its about ruling a world that isnt torn to pieces.

Then again, I am planning to play a Chosen first. :lol:

[Nathar]

And if you look at the total post count there'll be more roleplayers than there's elves totally. Not that I mind, but it's an impressive fact isn't it?

Meh, it means nothing! Reading way too much into stuff like that.

[Kozai]

Pretty sure pre release WoW's horde seemed the most popular but come release .... you couldn't move but for those long eared blue skinned freaks. And I bet the same things gonna happen in WAR.

Once the masses get the game the dreaded LotR syndrome is gonna hit and Order is gonna slam threw the roof. /sigh why couldn't the Robert E. Howard - Conan saga have been published first. Damn you Robert you should have been born earlier:( same goes for freitz lieber and hp lovecraft and the other writers of the dark fantastc.

[Tlear]

Don't worry xxxLegolarassszzxxx will save the day

[Delolith]

And an army of Drizztzzzttsstzzz will be there to confront this menacing beast...

Delolith (aka the most feared character in European PvP server EQ2 June 2006-March 2007)

[Chielz0r]

riiiight..

[Vikingkingq]

The main argument against this is that this forum does not represent the overall gamer base. This is a fundamentally flawed argument. Are the people who browse these forums aliens from another planet? No, they are human beings like the rest of us that share similar thoughts and opinions on what is "cool" and what isn't. As I have already mentioned, we can assume that many people who join the game after release should share vaguely similar ideas on what is cool. Therefore the overall disparity between good and evil will remain relatively the same with a slight margin of error. Especially when one considers that there currently exists a 4-1 evil to good, and sometimes 8-1 Dark Elf to High Elf disparity. This shows a dramatic affinity for the "evil" classes that will absorb any slight change in trends from the new population of gamers that join post-release.

I should also mention that one of the main reasons for this disparity is that the good guys have nothing which really distinguishes them from the evil guys that has traditionally attracted many gamers to the side of good in the past. Evil has elves and good has Elves. Elves have traditionally been a powerful attraction to the side of good, yet both sides have them.

Evil will most certainly outbalance good at release.

Actually, this argument has more merit than you might think.

People who browse these forums are human beings, but they are also a specific fanbase of people who know about Warhammer and have been following the game for some time. They tend also to be more likely to self-define as "hardcore" players. And as we can see, this group of people is more likely to play stereotypically bad races, for a number of reasons. When WAR goes to release, what will happen is that swiftly the majority of customers will be people who hadn't followed the game for two years but had rather saw the box in a game store and thought it looked cool. This general population is more likely to play the stereotypically good side, for a number of reasons.

A good example of this is World of Warcraft. During the original beta, there was a substantial Horde majority on the Beta forums, and there were the same kinds of concerns that balance would be thrown in the Horde's favor. When WoW took off following release, the numbers rapidly shifted the other way, to where Alliance was 2:1 to the Horde.

I personally expect a similar thing to happen with WAR. In the first few months, we will see a majority of players in Destruction, but then as the general public comes on board, the numbers will swing the other way.

[Delolith]

Bite your tongue Vikingkingg:( Usually, the side that is outnumbers is better organised, the people tend to form tighter alliances...and also advance in skill. I hope Warhammer won't be another WoW no2.

Delolith (aka the most feared character in european PvP server EQ2 June 2006- March 2007).

[ChosenOne]

The various server types will change this drastically and possibly create an even greater divide in the imbalance.

[Estebar]

Here's something else to consider:

Now that all four classes have all been pretty much confirmed, it's agreed by most that it's definitely a winning combination of classes, having picked the best and most iconic of the units from the High Elf TT army (apart from, perhaps, the mute Phoenix Guards who weren't included for obvious reasons).

HOWEVER, one only has to look at each selected class to notice that each one carries its own personal controversy among the fans:

Swordmaster - Game mechanics aside, most people seemed to assume/believe/want the Swordmasters to be the melee dps class. Apparently, they were best suited to melee when looking at their TT equivalent. Some still have issues with the dancing, dodging Tank idea, seeing as he's the only one in the game. At least the Black Guard takes it like a man.

Archmage - Some assumed that being the best wizard around would allow the Archmage to have the greatest magical strength, and therefore would be best suited to the ranged dps class, tossing nuclear rainbow lasers of doom around. Relegating them as a healer diminishes their ranged capability to the point where they'll be outmatched by human wizards.

Shadow Warrior - Lacking in shadow magic, which some believed they would get to compensate for their somewhat bland Legolas-type Elven archery skill, we can but wonder just how innovative the SW's dual-path is as a game mechanic, and it's only a matter of time before we have a million Legolases running around in hooded capes.

White Lions - Some believed that the lion pet diminished the overall strength of the White Lion, who was meant to be the strongest out of all Elves. The fact that the melee-concentrated High Elves have to depend on a big white kitty cat with a braided beard to help them in combat does nothing for the stereotyping.

...so there you have it. Despite the High Elf boards seeming strangely calm and somewhat harmonious when compared to the tempestuous debating going on in the Dark Elf forums, each of the four High Elf classes has gone through a period of debate at some point during their development.

I'd just like to note that these contraversies do NOT reflect my own personal opinions of the four classes. I'm actually very happy with the way the High Elves have turned out. Just thought I'd gather up the general problems that have crept around the High Elf forums in the past to show the fans something interesting.

Is this is a good thing, or a bad thing? Do these controversies balance out the awesomeness of the four classes, keeping them from getting overplayed, or do they just make things worse for the High-Dark Elf ratio when the game finally arrives?

[ChosenOne]

The four classes of the High Elves tell me that High Elves could actually be the most damage oriented race of them all.

Swordmasters: As they fight their form becomes even greater allowing them to unleash heavily damaging attacks. They nimble moves allow them to dodge and parry attacks hence why they are the "tank"

Archmage: Seems they are just as much the magical ranged damage of the High Elves as they are the healing. They definately arent just healers. Good thing the High Elves are friendly with the dwarves and their Runepriests as well as the Humans for their melee range healers to be right next to the "dodge" tanks incase they have some bad luck with their dodges.

Shadow Warrior: A ranged dps class that will have decent skill at melee dps? Seems the High Elves in the early ranks are going to be swarming the Dark elves. But due to the fact that White Lions will also have a pet with them doing damage that means for every white lion player you actually have two toons in the melee fight. Much easier for Shadow Warriors to stay back when you have that kind of cover.

White Lions: Due to having a pet that means having two pools of hitpoints. So your White Lion high elf gets taunted? Does that affect his pet? Due to the High elves having potentially alot of steel and fangs in your face that makes the role of tank less necessary and heavier damage more necessary. This compliment added next to the ranks of humans and dwarves makes for a very, very nasty combo.


Perhaps the Dark Elves will end up complimentary to this, who knows. Personally so far I would have to say the High Elf way is looking very promising to me.

[Dracius]

Actually, this argument has more merit than you might think.

People who browse these forums are human beings, but they are also a specific fanbase of people who know about Warhammer and have been following the game for some time. They tend also to be more likely to self-define as "hardcore" players. And as we can see, this group of people is more likely to play stereotypically bad races, for a number of reasons. When WAR goes to release, what will happen is that swiftly the majority of customers will be people who hadn't followed the game for two years but had rather saw the box in a game store and thought it looked cool. This general population is more likely to play the stereotypically good side, for a number of reasons.

A good example of this is World of Warcraft. During the original beta, there was a substantial Horde majority on the Beta forums, and there were the same kinds of concerns that balance would be thrown in the Horde's favor. When WoW took off following release, the numbers rapidly shifted the other way, to where Alliance was 2:1 to the Horde.

I personally expect a similar thing to happen with WAR. In the first few months, we will see a majority of players in Destruction, but then as the general public comes on board, the numbers will swing the other way.

QFFT the extra 'F' is a bad word =B

That's the exact same theory I have as far as the population goes. Having played numerous MMO's that had a more human/orderly faction and a more monster like/disordly type faction, the human side *COUGH*albions*cough* always comes out with a higher population. It's so predictable in fact, that I've been able to predict population balances quite accurately in the last several major MMO's. It's also the reason I usually play on the "evil" side, because I like a challenge.

It's for this fact, I'm actually GLAD to see that destro is outnumbering order on the polls. This means there's a better chance for balanced factions when it hits retail.

[Riddly]

To the OP, have to agree with the more recent posters that the release of the new HE classes change that perception...but that could just be the result of bandwagoners. Guess we'll have to see when the DE classes are confirmed, I expect there to be another craze for those classes.

Shadow warrior = Legolas, so ya, you're going to have a lot of kiddies on your side, sorry :confused:.

[Deshiva]

I find it amusing that somehow the fans on theese boards now seem to sorta replicate their racial choices, like mentioned we high elven players barely got arguments or discussions going on since we seem to know what we will get anyway. We are mostly content but fine with things as they are.

Dark elf players are literally killing eachother over what classes might be playable, they all making alot of noise and being noticable. And somehow I see this as a mirror of how both races would behave in the table top.

Probably sounds odd, but that's sorta how it feels. And I don't know how the populations will spread, I'll say that whatever imbalance we have in one race it will be in the favor of the other side on a different race. We have 6 different races with very different flavors, so there will probably be something for everyone.

That said I would sorta like a low population on high elves, it would feel appropiate with the elves being a very low population race. We work on quality not quantity. Though numerous dark elves would seem a bit odd, but I wouldn't really mind. As said high elves actually have very cool classes, just elves overall seem to be popular to bash as an act of being cool and hip.

One reason I see being that alot of "difficult" players like to play them because of their common image of beauty, but thoose kind of players are similar to the ones that play witch hunters because they possess two weapons and wear a cool hat. I don't mean to say that someone that plays a career because of thoose reasons are all the same. But you would have to say that many of them tend to be childish or immature, as being cool is more important to their mind than being nice, mature or good at playing.

Whoever judges by the covers haven't learned how to really look at things that matter more.

Another thing is that there is alot of pansy calling being flung around when it comes to elves, it's a bit annoying but laughable at worst. After all why is dodging a blow cowardice? Especially if compared to possessing so much armor it doesn't hurt to take it, the real coward is the one that hides in the layers of their armor. And obivously a real warrior tries his best to avoid hits rather than take them, it's not about being scared of wounds. It's about surviving long enough to do something worthwhile. "No one ever found victory in the dirt" to quote one of my favorite movies.

Oh and something that came to mind, I would like to see a movie with orcs as the "heroes" Even if I'm not a big fan of the greens, the very different angle would be very refreshing.

[Grimald]

I really hope High elves don't have as any people playing them as dark elves, i think it adds to the character of the developing community if they need to band together to face an over whelming foe. One good thing that comes out of the "legolas" rush is that when they get bored and give up whats left is a hardcore community who had to put up with taunts from the enemy and the l33t kiddies. One thing i'm hoping for is that with the new look at the rules for types of servers, rp servers may actully work.

[Ruinx]

I hate to say it, but this may be the most unbalanced pairing of the three. We constantly see more people in the DE forums, as much as 10x the amount. Paul pushes for Dark Elves every time you hear the guy speak. Being evil is becoming a fad. Not to mention all the perverts and girls who will be playing witch elves.

The masses of kiddies may change this once it is released, but do you think they will really be helping the war effort? Many of the players who just want to do PvE with minor PvP choose the good guys. So you are going to have to have more, just to field enough people actually willing to defend the territory with any form of brass. And I don't think the High Elves are going to have more.

If you genuinely believe this, then you must be new to MMORPGs.

Order will outnumber Destruction, just like in every other game.

People always say they are going to play the "evil" or dark side in MMORPGs during beta. The evil forum always gets more discussion. Then the vast hordes of "normal players" arrive, not the hardcore game-followers and beta-freaks, and BOOOOOM the game is filled with Happy Elves and Knights In Shining Armour and so on.

I really can't think of a side-based game where this didn't happen.

DAoC, WoW, EVE, any game which has some people who, on a simplistic level, seem "good" versus those who, superficially, seem "evil", then "good" will be more common, despite chat to the contrary in beta.

[ChosenOne]

Fact of the matter is, you cannot base the numbers in game of the factions on what you see in the forums. The percentage of total players that will use these forums is so low thats its absolutely rediculous to base such numbers on what you see here and on the other fansite forums.

While you can look at past games for an idea on how it will go with WAR, I personally believe WAR's races all offer something to all types of players. Yes shadow warriors MIGHT resemble a legolas type if you only look at the surface. Lorewise they are nothing at all like a legolas type.

The kids might like the class, but they also might like the DE classes, they also might like the insane looking chaos classes, they also might like the knights in shining armor of the empire, they also might like being orcs....you get my point.

All races will have all types of players. The task will be to sift through those numbers and find the type of players you wish to associate with and run with.

[Fusko]

Every time someone puts good or evil in quotations, I kill a baby.

The fact of the matter is, no one knows for 100%, nor has any proof, that X faction will be overpopulated compared to Y faction. And although you might be able to get an idea as we draw nearer to release, its still just guessing. And the kids that everyone seems to refer to, all the kiddies, and noobs, vary just as much as you do from the next person. You'll encounter a good amount on any faction.

ChosenOne pretty much got it right.

[Dracius]

Every time someone puts good or evil in quotations, I kill a baby.

"Evil"Good""Evil"Good""Evil"Good""Evil"Good""Evil"Good""Evil"Good""Evil"Good"

As far as the whole population debate thing goes, I'm gonna stay sided with Vikingkingq and Ruinx on this one. Population trends have always repeated themselves in every game up until now, there's no reason why anyone should think WAR is going to be any different.

It also doesn't matter if Order is really the good guys, or Destro are really the bad guys, when the newbs (people who are new to the game) log in, they'll see good and evil, and choose good.

Sure each side has it's selling points, but to say that Order is likely to be the more populated faction, is more than just "a guess". There are many examples of similar games that let you choose a side, and the population trend always ends up the same. Where as, examples of games where the bad guys outnumber the good guys, are quite rare.

The main draw of order however, will be the fact that it possesses the most played race in ever MMO, HUMANS. People like to play a character they can relate to, hence all the heated debate over the lack of female characters on Destro side.

Of course, only time will tell, and by then I'll have nothing but a dusty SS of this thread to say "We Told You So" with. ;-)

[Earth Dragon]

Now that they have split the server with different rules...................

I think the regualr servers are gonna be 4:1 order to destruction

The PvP servers will be 2:1 destruction to order.

I think that should have never been asked for, and all the people who were "actually" worrid about balanced just screwed themselves.

[Earth Dragon]

If you genuinely believe this, then you must be new to MMORPGs.

Order will outnumber Destruction, just like in every other game.

People always say they are going to play the "evil" or dark side in MMORPGs during beta. The evil forum always gets more discussion. Then the vast hordes of "normal players" arrive, not the hardcore game-followers and beta-freaks, and BOOOOOM the game is filled with Happy Elves and Knights In Shining Armour and so on.

I really can't think of a side-based game where this didn't happen.

DAoC, WoW, EVE, any game which has some people who, on a simplistic level, seem "good" versus those who, superficially, seem "evil", then "good" will be more common, despite chat to the contrary in beta.
I can garauntee Pirates of the Burning Sea will see more pirates then anything

[ChosenOne]

Hey Dracius, remember that Chaos faction is human based. While the more powerful might be changed to the point of being unrecognizable as humans, the majority are very human and that is very obvious.

[Earth Dragon]

Of course, only time will tell, and by then I'll have nothing but a dusty SS of this thread to say "We Told You So" with. ;-)
The funny thing is that I started this thread to make more discussion in the High Elf forums so it DIDN'T look so much like what I had originally posted.

I'm surprised though that everyone seems to be keeping to their "kiddies make elves" thing, which is completely irrelavant since BOTH sides will start with elves. I can ensure everyone here that horde would have seen more action if they started with Blood Elves. I'm sure they wouldn't have been even, but it would have mitigated quite a bit of the imbalance.

[Dracius]

Hey Dracius, remember that Chaos faction is human based. While the more powerful might be changed to the point of being unrecognizable as humans, the majority are very human and that is very obvious.
Order's humans are more natural looking, and thus I think that's going to be the main draw.

In DAOC every faction had humans, but Albs had 4 human races, and they were the most populated.

I do agree that each faction has it's pro's, and "shine" to it, but there's just certain trends that have yet to be broken. I also wouldn't worry too much about the types of players that will populate each race though, because if we've all learned one thing from gaming, it's that there's enough idiots to populated every race, and the movie clones rarely reach the end game.

[Smachaz]

The funny thing is that I started this thread to make more discussion in the High Elf forums so it DIDN'T look so much like what I had originally posted.

I'm surprised though that everyone seems to be keeping to their "kiddies make elves" thing, which is completely irrelavant since BOTH sides will start with elves. I can ensure everyone here that horde would have seen more action if they started with Blood Elves. I'm sure they wouldn't have been even, but it would have mitigated quite a bit of the imbalance.

True, and if Undead looked as cool as Chaos you can bet your there would of been ALOT more. Mind you it was still one of the most populated races.

WoW is hardly a reference for population problems. Horde toons were so badly done, all of them had hunchbacks and looked stupid in armor.

[Feigro]

Horde toons were so badly done, all of them had hunchbacks and looked stupid in armor.

I won't comment on the quality of the modelling. But I would definitely agree with the armor sentiment to a point. It appeared in many cases, at least pre-BC, there was very much a "Human" bias to all the armor. Even the Night Elves looked silly in the bulk of it. It's as if they use the Human as the base, and just toss it on the other models. Which ends up worse for Horde, because alot of armor seems very alliance centrict. The only relief from this being Leather.

Which is actually one of the biggest selling points to me for WAR. It's such a simple thing, be class-based, cohesive armor sets is just too good. a Dwarf and an Elf shouldn't share the same armor. Nor Should a Magus and a Bright Wizard.

[Avatar Of War]

Yes I hate to say it, but your right about how armor fit for the horde.

Although i will say this about the 'graphics' People keep mentioning

People keep hating on WoW's Graphics and 'cartoonie" style yet WoW has more active accounts than any MMO period. If the graphics were really that bad I am pretty sure Blizzard would have done something by now.

As other people have stated in a plethora of post on other boards:
World of Warcraft sacrificed cutting edge graphics and such, for a insanely graceful and magnificent art style that would allow almost anyone with any connection to be able to play there game, and still be on par or better than most other 'cutting edge' MMO's.

Because we all know how great bleeding edge worked for EQ2 and Vanguard....



Finally; Just because you don't like or get something does not mean its bad. If that were the case then there would be no modern music(if our grandparents had there way) or if we had our way, no Classical music.

9 million people are willing to 'make do' with WoW's "crappy graphics'

Just because you don't like or get Picasso, does not mean his work is irrelevent or bad. It just means you don't like Picasso.

[Ruinx]

I can garauntee Pirates of the Burning Sea will see more pirates then anything

PotBS isn't side-based, as I understand it, or rather, it has multiple factions you can be associated with (British, French, Spanish, etc.), and one man's "pirate" is another man's "privateer". It's certainly not "Pirates vs Navies" in a straight fight.

As for your guesses about the different servers, they're nonsensical exaggerations of what is actually likely.

If you look at WoW's PvP servers vs PvE servers, the vast majority of PvP servers are around 1:1 (varying where one side will have 1.2 to 1.5, often but not always the Horde), and the majority of PvE servers WERE around 1.5-2:1 Alliance:Horde (but the TBC PvE servers are the opposite).

There are a few which which the extremes you describe, but they're the exceptions, not the rule. It occurred in DAoC, too. On most servers, Albion was by far the biggest Realm, often having over 40% of the population (which is a big deal in a three-realm game, where 33% is expected), but was somewhat ineffectual, typically. However on, where was it, Merlin? Mid had more than 50% of the population, and they were well-organised, and basically just laughingly owned the Frontier to the point where a lot of people re-rolled off the server.

Population imbalances are bad, but ones as extreme as you describe are unlikely as anything but the outliers.

[Xilbalba]

I don't think HE's willl have anythign to worry about in the pop department. They basically just announced a class thats a cross betweeen Legolas and a ninja, throw in the extra bitter emo crap and people will flock to the HE's like adolecsent teenage girls to a boy band. ;)

[Andrus]

WoW being the only experience with MMO's, the big difference between WoW and WAR in terms of population is that both ORDER and DESTRUCTION have elves. Which gives it a 50/50 in terms of population predictions. Then again, WAR is another mmo. BUt meh, who knows.

[Zandalar]

WoW being the only experience with MMO's, the big difference between WoW and WAR in terms of population is that both ORDER and DESTRUCTION have elves. Which gives it a 50/50 in terms of population predictions. Then again, WAR is another mmo. BUt meh, who knows.
interesting i agree for the people who normally want to play elves like in WoW but they now have to option to play elves on the other side(bad elves) and for the people who normally are the human players the now have more human like people. That were human at one point but gave unto curruption. If i was a newb and only played human in previous mmo's i think that would make me gravitate towards chaos ... they sound damn cool.

[BeldarinSkysabre]

The only MMO I'd ever play a Human in is RL.

Or WAR, but that's only because the classes are actually unique to each race. Personally, I'm playing a High Elf Shadow Warrior, but that's based on class not race.

[Hayden]

I think for once it might be pretty equal for an MMO. I think both Order and Destruction has something for everyone.

When it comes to WoW, horde had nothing that interested me. I can't stand Orcs, old men draped in rags or hunchback trolls. I'd rather not play a race that I eat for dinner every second night either. Horde had nothing appealing in terms of look or story to me, just the typical misunderstood monster gimmick. It had nothing to do with a lack of 'pretty' it had to do with a lack of anything interesting. If you loved the goth scene or an endless stretch of desert it was the place for you though.

In DAoC Albion was probably the most overpopulated when it was released and while I was playing. That's probably because the Camelot mythos is well known and all the heroes you have heard of are from the Albion side. I don't think many 12 year olds know much of Cuchulain or Bragi. Hibernia was the least populated not only because of the poorly done 'golf course' environment but because the mythos behind it wasn't well known.

I don't think High Elves will be underpopulated at all. I think it will be Empire in the lead by a huge margin followed by High Elves then Dwarves in last place Order side. For Destruction it will probably be something like Chaos, Dark Elves, Orcs. It's funny because they all line up population wise. You won't know until the game starts but this game above all others seems like it will be somewhat balanced in comparison.

Both sides need fun, interesting classes/races and they also need to look well polished in comparison. I think this game has it done well.

[Avatar Of War]

People new to MMO's tend to gravitate to the 'good side'. In this case that would be Order.

I believe there will be a despairity in the beginning just like any other MMO, but only time will tell...

[ChosenOne]

I have a feeling that the open rvr servers will tend to be a bit heavier numbers on the destruction side and the core rules heavier on the Order side. Not saying every server will be that way but a majority. Could be wrong, could be completely wrong. Will just have to wait and see.

[Dracius]

In DAoC Albion was probably the most overpopulated when it was released and while I was playing. That's probably because the Camelot mythos is well known and all the heroes you have heard of are from the Albion side. I don't think many 12 year olds know much of Cuchulain or Bragi. Hibernia was the least populated not only because of the poorly done 'golf course' environment but because the mythos behind it wasn't well known.


Interesting, on the servers I played on, and on all the server polls, Hib's pop was between Mid and Alb, the Mids were the least populated. Only reason I can figure the Hibs had more, was the elf factor, and their zones weren't as dull and boring. Lots of Mid players committed suicide before ever reaching level cap, in those dull gray zones. :D

I'm stickin' to my current predictions for WAR's pop balance though. Destro may have some kick appeal to it this time around, but plain ole run of the mill joe schmo humans always take the lead.

[Overpowdered Rouge]

Pretty sure pre release WoW's horde seemed the most popular but come release .... you couldn't move but for those long eared blue skinned freaks. And I bet the same things gonna happen in WAR.

Once the masses get the game the dreaded LotR syndrome is gonna hit and Order is gonna slam threw the roof. /sigh why couldn't the Robert E. Howard - Conan saga have been published first. Damn you Robert you should have been born earlier:( same goes for freitz lieber and hp lovecraft and the other writers of the dark fantastc.

There's a big diffrence between WoW and WAR

WoW = ugly vs sexy, hence the 70/30 ratio in favor of alliance

WAR = sexy vs sexy....with huge black armor

EQ = dark elves vs high elves...lets just say the dark elves got enough high elf kaboobs to last them a lifetime

[thelastlogan]

i dont think our players will be coming in as order players i think there be going to be on the side of destruction...

[Tyrith Palantír]

If it ends up with more DE players then HE it just means more fun for us High elves:mrgreen:

[PlagueLord]

edited for content

[epicatlantis]

Dont worry, when the game comes out and all the kids and legolas wannabes start playing, it will be no problem.
The problem with that is.
The "Legolas" people will play Shadow Warrior or Swordmaster most likely.

The ratio of Support(Archmage) will be very low against those two.
1:10 at least.

[Senryth]

If it ends up with more DE players then HE it just means more fun for us High elves:mrgreen:

I back this up :p

[thelastlogan]

The problem with that is.
The "Legolas" people will play Shadow Warrior or Swordmaster most likely.

The ratio of Support(Archmage) will be very low against those two.
1:10 at least.

why is everyone saying people are picking shadow warriors becuase of Legolas. i haven't seen one person say anything about picking shadow warriors because of him...

speak for your self not for others.

[Ceandric]

why is everyone saying people are picking shadow warriors becuase of Legolas. i haven't seen one person say anything about picking shadow warriors because of him...

speak for your self not for others.

Well, I would guess that most of those that are currently on these forums are people that know a bit about the franchise and therefore choosing what they really think they want to play. The people that will go "oooh, I'll roll an archer elf and call him Legolazz" are the people that will join once the game is out, mostly those people that are still psyched about Legolas's "moves" in the films.

[Kaeldor]

Well, I would guess that most of those that are currently on these forums are people that know a bit about the franchise and therefore choosing what they really think they want to play. The people that will go "oooh, I'll roll an archer elf and call him Legolazz" are the people that will join once the game is out, mostly those people that are still psyched about Legolas's "moves" in the films.

I wonder why so many people do as that is a kind of truth. Probalby people who really want to play a Legolas clone would role one on the LOTRE MMO. I really doubt the Shadow Warrior class will be overun by Legolas wannabies. A ranger/sniper class as such will appeal to many poeple, so probalby it'll be a well played class, with Legolas clones just being one small faction.

[Delolith]

In EQ2 there was a ranger class that supported elven characters too. The class was basically how the shadow warrior is supposed to be snipy and all. In the PvP server that I played I seriously didn't bump on any Logolas clone of the class. Maybe on a blue server...but at least I haven't. And to top that....a lot of the players who were playing a ranger were VERY good /hats off to you Andariel and Picata...if you ever move your butts to this game it will be awsome ;)

Delolith

[Kopal]

I'm so glad LoTR is out. And i hope all of these children went their and play their legolas.
By the way, do you know what hint the game the player gives when you come to choose a name for your charakter ?
" Legolas, ...(some other names).., are common elven names..."

I had to laugh ^^

anyway, their will always be classes which attract spezial kind of people. such ans the witch Hunter will certainly played by Van Helsing fans and so on ..

I realy don't ask someone for thr reasons he playes the class, but if he stars acting like a little child or name his character after a move charakter ( lets say a witch Hunter calling himselv Van Helding or somehin like that) he find himself on a list of poeple i will never play with or talk to.

Well, what was the topic again ? ahh yes ..
I seriously couldn't tell if there will be more High Elves or Dark Elves, and neither could you.
since their seem to be more chaos player overall, High Evles in fact might have it the best of all Order races. Or do you think there will be more dwarfs and Humans then Elves ?

[Droogie]

The amount of skilled, mature players and the amount of "kiddies" on each side always seems to balance out.

Every side has its skilled people who are a joy to play with, and every side has their headaches.
I think we will see a decently equal total number of DEs vs HEs, even if the forums dont say so now.

[mikaleon]

I want an imbalance, I want the struggle to defend Ulthuan to be epic.

Let them come.

[Nassarm]

imo I'd rather play HE than DE because Dark Elves just plain annoy me (i hate the the race, not the people who play them) and it will be a great stress reliever to slice a few open...

I personally don't care about "legolas wanabees" because if people like a certain play style (i.e. Bows and arrows) i respect that, and everyone should do so too (^-^), I personally am into the characters who like to use big swords to slice open a few intestines. :D

One point im going to make... I know a few people on WoW around 14 years old who are some of the best characters on my server, age doesn't necessarily dictate skillz in a game, i'm sure most of you people were playing video games when yous were in your early teens. The more people who bolster the HE numbers the better, we kinda need as many as we can get.


P.S. I'm guna play a SwordMaster at release due to the fact they're practically the Jedis of the old world! Does that make me an Obi-Wan Kinobi wanabee??

[Scith]

I hate to say it, but this may be the most unbalanced pairing of the three. We constantly see more people in the DE forums, as much as 10x the amount. Paul pushes for Dark Elves every time you hear the guy speak. Being evil is becoming a fad. Not to mention all the perverts and girls who will be playing witch elves.

The masses of kiddies may change this once it is released, but do you think they will really be helping the war effort? Many of the players who just want to do PvE with minor PvP choose the good guys. So you are going to have to have more, just to field enough people actually willing to defend the territory with any form of brass. And I don't think the High Elves are going to have more.

and another thing about witch elves. they are the closest to a wow rogue so, overpopulation! I think that is why they MAY be making a HE pet class, just to try and even it out (melee hunter ftw)

[thestarheart]

well they said each side, order and destruction, would have a pet class. sooo since theres only one class left I would say HE's definitely have a pet class.

[Kosme]

well they said each side, order and destruction, would have a pet class. sooo since theres only one class left I would say HE's definitely have a pet class.

Yep ... and they allsow said in a grab bag that the order pet class was melee.

[Zunjin]

Without reading the posts before me ( sorry, bit in a hurry ) I can say right away that the de forum got alot of interesting people writing there. Draws your attention

[Drahcar]

I see all these people posting about Legolas wannabes well I personally didnt like legolas aside from the fact that Orlando Bloom played him I liked Gimli, the Witch King and Aragorn so who is to say that people wont play Black Guards to be the Witch King or wont play Dwarf Hammerers to be Gimli. The fact is there are a lot of characters besides Legolas I personally like the idea of being an archer but I am really interested in a White Lion reading about them.

So I think there will be a balance in some way be it skill vs numbers or organization against mad rushes. I have played WoW and I know the rumors of imbalance arent true but I do know there are a few servers who are totally unbalanced now because of the transfer system.

I personally am going to play Order because my friend wants to play an engineer but it does not mean I am going to be good infact ever heard of a dark souled hero?

[Nassarm]

to be honest, i've seen FAR FAR more dwarves in other games calling themselves "GIMLI" than Elves who call themselves "LEGOLAS".

[ChosenOne]

Its just certain people think they have to rail upon elves and elf players. Its not really rational but hey, once release is here we wont have to worry about it. Hell, I already dont worry about it. If all someone has to say is high elves are made up of legolas wannabe's then thats really not putting much thought into it.

[Daedarin]

I'm not too sure of the this hype about the Legolas wannabes. In the LOTR books, legolas is a cool and interesting character. A good a bit aloof archer type. I think that most people have filled out their fantasies about being a superduper archer in WoW. Playing an archer is of course fun to many, so the SW will get its amount of people. I think many players will not play WAR as their first MMO, and so will probably want to side with the bad guys. They have tried being knights in shining armor, so now they will try to be Darth Vader (Astma sounds). I predict the possibility of playing a cool looking evil elf will appeal to more newcomers than the aestetic good elf.

I am rolling order because I really like High Elves and have always done. Thats based on lore and the looks of the character. Not because of a movie. Just can't wait to see those swift moves in action...

[FoulPet]

And as you so eloquently put, "the perverts and girls" will be playing Witch Elves. If the only reason people pick a class is to look sexy, I don't expect them to be that good at PvP anyway.

Are you saying HE Females will look ugly and wont be played by pervs and girls ?

[nighthawk999]

Looking forward to crushing the inkys with my highly polished boots ;)

As far as the types of player each side attracts, having come from many other MMO's it generally balanced out and even if one side attracts more kiddies, then woohoo for the High Elf army, nothing beats smacking 7 bells of s*** out of a cocky 14 year old legally :D....err I'll get my coat...

[Bane Grimsinger]

not everyone plays a High Elf to look like Legolas.....

[Dan da Man]

not everyone plays a High Elf to look like Legolas.....
qft

I, for instance, am playing a HE because I just love HE's.
Rolling an archer not because of legolas but because i love being an archer.

And as to the whole legolas elf things, if people want to look like legolas they wont find any character who looks like him in any race. The HE's dont even look remotely like Legolas imho.

[gstwo]

I was actually wondering about this. If this is the case, I'm alright with playing the underdog. I recall playing iseult-hibernia when DAoC first came out and we were so underpopulated, but it was a blast nonetheless and we got some really good 8v8 teams to battle some of the good alb/mid 8v8 teams that were arising at the time. But, about that...if it does come to fruition that DE greatly outnumbers the HE's...I'm wondering, can dwarves and humans come to help with the HE war effort in their battlefronts, or is it dwarves stay with dwarves battlefront/humans with humans/HE's with HE's etc. I wasn't sure about that and hadn't really researched it thoroughly to understand if other races of one particular realm (albeit Order or Chaos) can all merge into one battlefront or hip-hop to other ones of other races whenever there is like a calling if there is an alliance between guilds.

[Kaeldor]

I was actually wondering about this. If this is the case, I'm alright with playing the underdog. I recall playing iseult-hibernia when DAoC first came out and we were so underpopulated, but it was a blast nonetheless and we got some really good 8v8 teams to battle some of the good alb/mid 8v8 teams that were arising at the time. But, about that...if it does come to fruition that DE greatly outnumbers the HE's...I'm wondering, can dwarves and humans come to help with the HE war effort in their battlefronts, or is it dwarves stay with dwarves battlefront/humans with humans/HE's with HE's etc. I wasn't sure about that and hadn't really researched it thoroughly to understand if other races of one particular realm (albeit Order or Chaos) can all merge into one battlefront or hip-hop to other ones of other races whenever there is like a calling if there is an alliance between guilds.

Dwarves and Empire players can come over to help out HE if they want to ... so we probalby won't see any dwarves : ).

[Fat Otaku]

Elvs does have itsz badz. Dez melts in me mouth and not in mez hand.

[Covenant Prophet]

Elvs does have itsz badz. Dez melts in me mouth and not in mez hand.

And somehow I find myself pitying the greenskins...wonder why. :p

[Fat Otaku]

And somehow I find myself pitying the greenskins...wonder why. :p

Wun qweztun f'yaz. Salt or peppa?

[Scirrocco]

Wun qweztun f'yaz. Salt or peppa?

Pepper please. I find when eating greenskins they usually need a bit more color since they're mainly green. Something to add a little zaz.

[Covenant Prophet]

Pepper please. I find when eating greenskins they usually need a bit more color since they're mainly green. Something to add a little zaz.

Clearly you are joking. No self-respecting Elf would ever consume so crude a food source. Perhaps he can be used as scrap meat for the White Lions?

[wellsy]

Nah, I think the Lion wouldn't eat that too.

[justsomeguy]

High Elves get the ranged healer. Dark Elves get the melee healer. Numbers aside, advantage High Elf. However, I can imagine High Elves being among the least populous of the factions. We'll have to wait and see how exactly it plays out.