Engineer limitations

[Greyscale]

Massively's review of the engineer gave us a bit off info on how the class will play, however we still don't know what kind of limits will be placed on our abilities. Therefore I thought I would post my questions so we could speculate about them (and maybe find some answers if they are out there).

The questions...

How many turrets can an engineer have up at the same time?

How many mines can an engineer lay down?

How long time does it take to build a turret?

How easily are turrets destroyed?

Can an engineer repair a damaged turret?

I should also mention that I am not looking for exact numbers here and that I am aware that a lot of things can and will change until the game goes live.

[Feigro]

The questions...

How many turrets can an engineer have up at the same time?

How many mines can an engineer lay down?

How long time does it take to build a turret?

How easily are turrets destroyed?

Can an engineer repair a damaged turret?

I should also mention that I am not looking for exact numbers here and that I am aware that a lot of things can and will change until the game goes live.

Based entirely off of ancient info (though the Engineer has likely maintained his form more so than the magus), and therefore subject to changed, or subject to being entirely obsolete;

1) One turret at a time. Though at one point a tactic appeared suggesting you could have two. Whether it remains depends on how important/powerful the turrets actually are. My opinion? 1 turret at a time.

2) Same as above. Replace "turret" with mine. Though, I could see them keeping the "two mines" tactic.

3) A few seconds, from memory of old videos I'd say somewhere in the vicinity of 3-5

4) No info

5) No info, though I'd assume so.

[Picklesnshakes]

Same as above. For question 5, the answer is yes, engineers can repair their turrets.

Question 4 is the only one I don't know. I'd assume they're moderately hearty, or else engineers would have to be placing them all the time, and would make repairing them pointless. I'd guess about the same amount of health that turrets in TF2 have.

[Greyscale]

Thanks for the answers. I must say that I hope that the engineer will be able to have more than one mine up, I think it would be more practical ;).

Another question which you might be able to answer Feigro, in those videos you saw did the engineer have to interact with a turret while building it or can he use other abilities during the "build time"?

[Feigro]

The construction of the turret (at the time) is exactly like using an ability. He kneels down, cast timer ticks off, and the turret is built when the timer is done. Just like summoning a pet or casting a spell. So no, you can't do anything else while constructing a turret.

[Greyscale]

That's shame, but we can't have everything can we :rolleyes:.

[Picklesnshakes]

I mean...if you wanted the engineer to build a turret AND shoot his gun/throw a grenade, he wouldn't be a dwarf. He'd be chaos...with 4 arms.

[Greyscale]

I mean...if you wanted the engineer to build a turret AND shoot his gun/throw a grenade, he wouldn't be a dwarf. He'd be chaos...with 4 arms.

Bah, apperently Multitasking is a unknown concept among Dwarfs. :)

[Picklesnshakes]

I mean, unless the dwarf wants to hold his gun with his beard and pull the trigger by kicking a tripwire with his foot over and over, it's going to be very difficult to build a quality turret and do something else. Now if you mean like, begin to build a turret, pause to shoot or throw a grenade, and then go back to building, that would be fine, but you would have to stop the progress meter for turret construction accordingly. The way I see it though, turrets go up so fast that it would almost be pointless to pause rather than just wait the extra second or two to finish.

[Feigro]

Just an update;

In this (http://warhammeronline.tv/video/183/baltimore-games-day-2008) video it appears the turret pops out independently of the Engineer (not requiring a caste time). It drops onto the battlefield from a crate.

[Baradun_Mod]

It appears that Feigro has beaten me to it, but in the link he provided I've noticed in this Baltimore 08 video turrets are pretty much instant casts now as they seem to fall from the sky in boxes, perhaps dropped by gyrocopters? *shrug*. In past videos however they have been timed which tended to post a problem for the Engineers survivability, which I'm guessing is why it was recently changed.

I'm not sure about mines, there was no firm info on them in this video that I could see.

[Otik]

Just an update;

In this (http://warhammeronline.tv/video/183/baltimore-games-day-2008) video it appears the turret pops out independently of the Engineer (not requiring a caste time). It drops onto the battlefield from a crate.

If you watch the video, you also see the turret getting beat on for a small amount of time and still stay standing. I would think that with how fast they are popped out, having them get taken out will not be a big issue.

[Orock]

One turret, one mine, and one bugmans ale (combination of beer and painkillers) for a heal-kinda dangerous to mix alcohol and painkillers if you ask me.

Also one of their big limitations they said in the report was they were not 'run and gun' so they defend areas well but dont do so hot on the shoot and move. That could hurt when there is a meelee in our faces.

[Picklesnshakes]

I would think that engineers are the best suited RDPS to face MDPS, since they can still do damage with their turrets while the enemy chases them around. Engineers also have a slew of melee abilities that can at least offer them some resistance. Keep in mind, the MDPS by this time should already be damaged from the engineers ranged attacks.

[Orock]

Actually from videos it looks like there the LEAST able to handle meelee attacks. If you watch the new video from baltimore (yes I realize hes not an expert at the class and could have played smarter) he pretty much drops his turret right away as the marauder croses the bridge and opens up...only to be run down and chopped to bits.

If you watch the bright wizard he is spamming his aoe snares and fire cage which is a crazy multiperson root. And of course the shadow warrior is full of tricks to get back in range.

No I think the price we are going to pay for superior area denial is severe weakness to meelee attacks. But if my group is doing its job I wont mind, and I think I can live with that weakness for the sweet other things we get.

[Size_Twelve]

No I think the price we are going to pay for superior area denial is severe weakness to meelee attacks. But if my group is doing its job I wont mind, and I think I can live with that weakness for the sweet other things we get.

Yeah I agree. Weakness to mdps worries me less than my own damage output and utility. I can accept that a heavy mdps class will tear me a new one if he gets his hands on me, but I want to be able to hurt him from range too.

Based on the video footage I saw, it didn't look like we were doing all that much rdps. Maybe the opponents were mostly in heavy armor, but who knows. I'll happily take my weaknesses, as long as my strengths are just as obvious.

[Njor]

I doubt we will be that weak against melee dps. We're less fragile than the bright wizard, and got loads of CC. In general I guess engineers will be 'weaker' in 1v1 battles and 'stronger' in larger battles.

[logicalmayhem]

Based entirely off of ancient info (though the Engineer has likely maintained his form more so than the magus), and therefore subject to changed, or subject to being entirely obsolete;

1) One turret at a time. Though at one point a tactic appeared suggesting you could have two. Whether it remains depends on how important/powerful the turrets actually are. My opinion? 1 turret at a time.

2) Same as above. Replace "turret" with mine. Though, I could see them keeping the "two mines" tactic.

3) A few seconds, from memory of old videos I'd say somewhere in the vicinity of 3-5

4) No info

5) No info, though I'd assume so.

/agree and i dont think repairing will be necessary as turrets are totally disposable.

now for the more interesting question

"what will mages use as a landmine trap substitute if they have 1 at all"

my self im happy if we are a RDPS class with turrets and give us less stationary defences for more offensive capability and de buffs. land mines dont seem very chaosy

like to hear your opinions

[Gorothar]

Actually from videos it looks like there the LEAST able to handle meelee attacks. If you watch the new video from baltimore (yes I realize hes not an expert at the class and could have played smarter) he pretty much drops his turret right away as the marauder croses the bridge and opens up...only to be run down and chopped to bits.

If you watch the bright wizard he is spamming his aoe snares and fire cage which is a crazy multiperson root. And of course the shadow warrior is full of tricks to get back in range.

No I think the price we are going to pay for superior area denial is severe weakness to meelee attacks. But if my group is doing its job I wont mind, and I think I can live with that weakness for the sweet other things we get.

Man, it has sort of worried me how, basically through every description on any character it's been more or less "he's good at this and that, his weakness is this, but he can still make himself felt there as well". To me, this is counter to the team feeling I sense they are trying to create with WAR. If I play an engineer, I want the tank in front of me keeping everyone off me so that I can hook up a large canon to blast the enemy to bits. If a maurader gets through, you're screwed .. but that's how it should be imo. I like it better when classes are more defined I guess.. That said, this is all based on information from the internets since I haven't got access to any beta..

My point though: I agree with you.

[Otik]

No I think the price we are going to pay for superior area denial is severe weakness to meelee attacks. But if my group is doing its job I wont mind, and I think I can live with that weakness for the sweet other things we get.

Pretty much, seeing how we are the "squishies" of the game as we wear the lightest of armors so far as I have seen. I have no doubt the Engineer (like most classes in this game) that are played very well will be deadly though.

Just think of playing " Ring around the Turret" with most enemies while lobbing grenades.

[Greyscale]

/agree and i dont think repairing will be necessary as turrets are totally disposable.

now for the more interesting question

"what will mages use as a landmine trap substitute if they have 1 at all"

...

like to hear your opinions

With turrets being instant cast I agree that they are disposable, however if they had required build time it would be rather annoying to keep our defences up without the possibility to repair the turrets.

As for the Magus version of landmines, perhaps they'll get a selection of PBAoE spell based from their disc? I think it could work similar, but not too similar to our the engineer landmines (twisted mirrors and all that).

Just think of playing " Ring around the Turret" with most enemies while lobbing grenades.

That's my plan as well :p

[Picklesnshakes]

Magi and Engineers don't have to be exact mirrors. I would prefer it if they weren't, honestly. Give engineers their landmines, and give the magus something unique to himself. Gives an incentive to play the opposite faction sometime.

[Dwarfengineer]

maybe the engineers will be weak but based on old powers i saw they will be deadly to MDPS. They have many powers to kite and disable the enemy so you can get away and shoot the hell out their head :x Theres no need to get scared that engineers will be weak they look to be a very dangerous opponent if not caught off graud

[Yumti]

With regards to turret health I think we can safely assume that they wont be 1hit kills, like WoW shaman totems, especially if you can only have 1 at a time.

I do however very much doubt that they can be used for pve tanking. That would make the engineer a pet class, which to my best knowledge, they are not.

[Dagda Redgranite]

With regards to turret health I think we can safely assume that they wont be 1hit kills, like WoW shaman totems, especially if you can only have 1 at a time.

I do however very much doubt that they can be used for pve tanking. That would make the engineer a pet class, which to my best knowledge, they are not.

Perhaps a turret that is designed specifically for distracting mobs, but yeah, I highly doubt the other turrets (gun, flame) will have enough HP to withstand a concentrated attack for very long.