So what's the hook?

[Grimbold]

I really like Dwarfs, I really do. They're my second favorite race in Warhammer, and if I wasn't addicted to Greenskins, I'd be all over the Dawi. That being said, I'd still like to roll an Ironbreaker, seeing as how they look awesome. But my question is, what's the hook on the Ironbreaker? I'm really liking Grudge, but it doesn't exactly bode well for you if your group is beging hit at all. I realize this could make the Ironbreaker more forimidable in RvR if the mechanic still works the same way. But, what other mechanics does the Ironbreaker have that makes them unique? Are they your physical order tanks like the Black Orcs, and have alot of stuns and disorients, or do they mainly just bash the snot out of people?

To summarize:
- I like Grudge
- What else is there that would make me want to roll one?
- <3 Dwarfs

[Haggen]

From what I've heard they are the physical tanks of the order, yes.
Think of them as a tin-can filled with grudge!

I mean, Grudge is their "main" mechanic, I doubt any classes have more than one "mechanic". So I'm guessing they have the basic tank tools (taunt and stuff) plus some skills with will benefit with the grudge you build.

I think the quote on warhammeronline.com says It best:
"To strike an Ironbreaker is to strike an anvil. You are more likely to re-shape your weapon than to move him… and heavens forbid one lands on you..."

I interprit from this quote: Hit him, and you'll do little to no damage, ignore him, and he'll crush you. (Not to be taken litteraly :))

[Grimbold]

From what I've heard they are the physical tanks of the order, yes.
Think of them as a tin-can filled with grudge!

I mean, Grudge is their "main" mechanic, I doubt any classes have more than one "mechanic". So I'm guessing they have the basic tank tools (taunt and stuff) plus some skills with will benefit with the grudge you build.

I think the quote on warhammeronline.com says It best:
"To strike an Ironbreaker is to strike an anvil. You are more likely to re-shape your weapon than to move him… and heavens forbid one lands on you..."

I interprit from this quote: Hit him, and you'll do little to no damage, ignore him, and he'll crush you. (Not to be taken litteraly :))

I like the way you think. I never really gave the whole Grudge mechanic much thought. I figured it was just a way for the Ironbreaker to keep aggro, I should read up on it some more. Hopefully it'll work to it's full advantage in RvR as well, that's be pretty great. It'd make getting pesky MDPS off of the healers that much easier.

[Noah Braveheart]

From what I've read in gamesday interviews, Ironbreakers are really, really hard to kill. Someone played an Ironbreaker and had a Runepriest following him, and he was able to take on about 4-5 people at once. I see a nerf coming their way, but I'd suggest rolling one at release before they get a phat nerf.

[Arnalerix]

If your group isn't being hit, you're doing your job as a tank.

As long as you can build grudge through ways OTHER than "hit my friends," it should work fine (so you can build up grudge to use your abilities while being focus-fired). Also, you'll still have your Action Points.

[Clangeddin]

From what I've read in gamesday interviews, Ironbreakers are really, really hard to kill. Someone played an Ironbreaker and had a Runepriest following him, and he was able to take on about 4-5 people at once. I see a nerf coming their way, but I'd suggest rolling one at release before they get a phat nerf.

When you say "take on", you mean that he resisted their attacks for a good amount of time, right? Not that he soloed em, I imagine. And also, why were they not attacking the runepriest if he was healing him the whole time?
If that's the case, then am truly happy to hear that and I hope the nerf you foresee won't ever happen, tanks are supposed to be... you know, tanks?
If in a mass pvp game like this I can't even endure 4-5 people ganking on me for a decent amount of time, then what would be the point in being a tank?
I know that calling WoW out might be old and tiresome, but there tanks were a joke in pvp, because they could be slaughtered in matter of seconds if ganked with spell nukes, unless they had healers spamming heals on them the whole time. Actually, the funny thing was that, in the end, certain specced warlocks ended up being almost as good if not even better than true tanking classes at pvp tanking, and that was absurd.
Sorry for the WoW parenthesis, I know this game won't be WoW, it was just to send through my message that tanks SHOULD be very, very, very durable in PvP, compared to other classes, else there would be no use for them.
Why should I roll a tank if I can get brushed away by 4-5 people who gank on me (likely to happen) in matter of seconds, just as fast as any other class gets killed?

Of course, I'm not saying tanks have to be immortal, but still they HAVE to hold their own versus multiple targets for a decent amount of times, without requiring healers to spam heals on them the whole time, even because it would be dreadful for the healers as well, who should be supposed to be doing, not only healing, but also some other kind of support with damage or other spells.

In the end, I say YES to "hard to kill tanks". Not just Ironbreakers, every tank out there needs to be durable. The supposed "CC" (which is going to be very little at disposal in this game) just wouldn't cut it.

[Gorothar]

When you say "take on", you mean that he resisted their attacks for a good amount of time, right? Not that he soloed em, I imagine. And also, why were they not attacking the runepriest if he was healing him the whole time?
If that's the case, then am truly happy to hear that and I hope the nerf you foresee won't ever happen, tanks are supposed to be... you know, tanks?
If in a mass pvp game like this I can't even endure 4-5 people ganking on me for a decent amount of time, then what would be the point in being a tank?
I know that calling WoW out might be old and tiresome, but there tanks were a joke in pvp, because they could be slaughtered in matter of seconds if ganked with spell nukes, unless they had healers spamming heals on them the whole time. Actually, the funny thing was that, in the end, certain specced warlocks ended up being almost as good if not even better than true tanking classes at pvp tanking, and that was absurd.
Sorry for the WoW parenthesis, I know this game won't be WoW, it was just to send through my message that tanks SHOULD be very, very, very durable in PvP, compared to other classes, else there would be no use for them.
Why should I roll a tank if I can get brushed away by 4-5 people who gank on me (likely to happen) in matter of seconds, just as fast as any other class gets killed?

Of course, I'm not saying tanks have to be immortal, but still they HAVE to hold their own versus multiple targets for a decent amount of times, without requiring healers to spam heals on them the whole time, even because it would be dreadful for the healers as well, who should be supposed to be doing, not only healing, but also some other kind of support with damage or other spells.

In the end, I say YES to "hard to kill tanks". Not just Ironbreakers, every tank out there needs to be durable. The supposed "CC" (which is going to be very little at disposal in this game) just wouldn't cut it.

This might be as good a place as any to wonder out loud about this.. Why are you even sorry you brought up WoW? It is by far the most popular MMORPG out there and by and large redefined the genre. It is perfectly valid to put up a comparison towards WoW because WoW did many things right and many things wrong. Now, WoW was primarily PvE, with PvP as an afterthough, and imo, Mythic would do well in drawing experiences from DAoC as well as comparing themselves to WoW to see what they did wrong, but in any discussion of WAR, a game we haven't really played, isn't it valid to compare it to the biggest game out there and say "WoW did this and this in PvP, that did not work too well, hopefully this will turn out different". In any case, you've put it into comparison for the millions of people who have played WoW, but have never played much PvP centric MMORPG's.

I see a lot of "but this game isn't WoW" and people saying "sorry to bring up WoW again", but really, let's be honest, it is, and will be for a long time, the game which other MMORPG's are measured against. Hell, you're post was a good post, no need in being sorry just because it drew comparisons to WoW imo.

[DammazKron]

I think you actually have 2 questions there.. if u put aside the game mechanics for a moment...

"Why play a Dwarf?"
They are so BLOODY hard. Manlings are soft. Druchii are Effete, Prancing 12 yr old Schoolgirls... Nuff Said

"Why play a tank?"
There is a lot to be said for playing a Glass Cannon glass, but their complete lack of survivability can be a real problem in PvP. I've played a lot of tanks in WoW and have lost count of the poor saps who have spent all their mana/rage/force trying to grind me down... only to watch them flee when they see I still have half a life bar. Makes me laugh every time :)

[Solidsnake]

not to criticize you but ranged dps are the class known as class cannons not tanks :P back on topic your choosing a dwarf so you can be a gruff, angry midget that loves to drink and fight, your choosing a tank for his unique tanking mechanic grudge which builds when your hit or other are hit I believe, this grudge is then used to help your allies and bring the pain.

[Tikuto]

From what I've read in gamesday interviews, Ironbreakers are really, really hard to kill. Someone played an Ironbreaker and had a Runepriest following him, and he was able to take on about 4-5 people at once. I see a nerf coming their way, but I'd suggest rolling one at release before they get a phat nerf.
Use magic against the Ironbreaker, then! :rolleyes: Set up a WAAGH with a Shaman devastating the Ironbreaker.

There's balance but I doubt balance would appeal to every career. Like Ironbreakers fighting a Sorcerer, who's more likely to win?
("physical tank" of the Ironbreaker more vulnerable to magical damage, right?)

[Arnalerix]

I hope it isn't "more vulnerable" so much as "as vulnerable as expected", while the Swordsmaster is "more resistant."

Semantics? Maybe. But words are important!

[lnquisitor]

"Why play a Dwarf?"
They are so BLOODY hard. Manlings are soft. Druchii are Effete, Prancing 12 yr old Schoolgirls.
Heheh the Druchii are school girls? If anything Dwarfs looks like children with beards.
How much more embarrassing will it be to be chopped into 3 pieces by a schoolgirl then?

I probably will not get to see the IB that much but eventually I'll make the trip to bang a Dwarf heads together like 3 stooges. Probably when the Greenskins are overrunning a city.

[DammazKron]

lol... okay... DE's are more like Effete, Prancing 12yr old Schoolgirls with a Drug problem but the end result is the same.

Good luck with that "Hiding behind the Greenskins" Plan... you've rolled the perfect race ;P

[Arnalerix]

Prancing twelve-year olds with giant halberds.

[Dunhill]

Gromril Armor.

nuff said

[soneil72]

From what I've read in gamesday interviews, Ironbreakers are really, really hard to kill. Someone played an Ironbreaker and had a Runepriest following him, and he was able to take on about 4-5 people at once. I see a nerf coming their way, but I'd suggest rolling one at release before they get a phat nerf.

If the 4-5 people that where fighting him just kept bashing away at the Iron Breaker and never killed the Rune Priest they deserve to lose, any good RvR player knows you kill the Healer/RDPS classes 1st they should have ignored the Iron Breaker till the Rune Priest was dead.

[Orock]

What other choice is there for a man who wants to be a tank, the only other tank order has is the swordmaster, and he's an elf so thats auto disqualification. Hell the female ironbreakers out manlyness male swordmasters by a ratio of at least 7:1:p

[Pheron Soulflayer]

If the 4-5 people that where fighting him just kept bashing away at the Iron Breaker and never killed the Rune Priest they deserve to lose, any good RvR player knows you kill the Healer/RDPS classes 1st they should have ignored the Iron Breaker till the Rune Priest was dead.
theyve said that you infact have to focus on others first rather than the rune priest because due to the runes and enchants hes hard to take down plus whilst your focusing on the rune priest out comes the ironbreaker and bam your dead so i wouldnt be ashamed if you cant down a runepriest because if you can play em right theyll be just as hard

[pyramid6]

What other choice is there for a man who wants to be a tank, the only other tank order has is the swordmaster, and he's an elf so thats auto disqualification. Hell the female ironbreakers out manlyness male swordmasters by a ratio of at least 7:1:p

I got to say I agree. I just wish it wasn't grudge. Unless it builds up quick, and only "finishing" actions need grudge. I would hate sitting there auto-attacking until I had enough grudge to use a skill.

[Grimr]

Heheh the Druchii are school girls? If anything Dwarfs looks like children with beards.
How much more embarrassing will it be to be chopped into 3 pieces by a schoolgirl then?

I probably will not get to see the IB that much but eventually I'll make the trip to bang a Dwarf heads together like 3 stooges. Probably when the Greenskins are overrunning a city.

No wonder your account got suspended after these silly comments. :p

[towerguarder]

they are awesome.. i like their viking style heavy Armour. Think it will be my main.. intended to play a marauder but switched over and convinced my friends to do the same cause destro seems more popular than order.. and i think order will be the underdogs..
anyway WAGH IS A'COMING!
BE PREPARED!

[The Penguin Hunter]

I got to say I agree. I just wish it wasn't grudge. Unless it builds up quick, and only "finishing" actions need grudge. I would hate sitting there auto-attacking until I had enough grudge to use a skill.


It's my understanding that Ironbreakers use AP like all other classes, Grudge merely increases their damage and unlocks a few things .. I think.

[Ghrenn]

Hell the female ironbreakers out manlyness male swordmasters by a ratio of at least 7:1:p

Heck yes we do!

Female ironbreakers are hot.

*Starts doing sexy girl dwarf dance*

[soneil72]

theyve said that you infact have to focus on others first rather than the rune priest because due to the runes and enchants hes hard to take down plus whilst your focusing on the rune priest out comes the ironbreaker and bam your dead so i wouldnt be ashamed if you cant down a runepriest because if you can play em right theyll be just as hard


If the 4-5 guy's are hitting the Rune Priest I guarantee you he is going to go down and then you can deal with the Iron Breaker, bashing on a Steel wall while it's getting repaired is not going to work.

[Kardan]

If the 4-5 guy's are hitting the Rune Priest I guarantee you he is going to go down and then you can deal with the Iron Breaker, bashing on a Steel wall while it's getting repaired is not going to work.


This is very true. While I can't give any specifics seeing as the NDA has not been lifted yet, Ironbreakers are incredible in both RvR and PvE. Holding aggro is not as hard as I first thought it would be, and there are plenty of ways to generate Grudge.

...We aren't allowed to post NDA breaking info on here, right?

[The Penguin Hunter]

Heck yes we do!

Female ironbreakers are hot.

*Starts doing sexy girl dwarf dance*


Ahh my eye!.. *starts to glance over at the dancing elf instead* .. Ahh my pride and Dwarfyness! *sighs and continues watching the dancing dwarf*

[Unwise]

Ahh my eye!.. *starts to glance over at the dancing elf instead* .. Ahh my pride and Dwarfyness! *sighs and continues watching the dancing dwarf*

Haha, thanks for the chuckle.

Swordmasters have been described as not being a very tanky tank, relying more on good DPS, magic resistance and verstitility. Given the demise of the KotBS, I think that the IB remain the only true tank class on the order side.

If other MMOGs are anything to go by, the Swordmaster will be seen (rightly or wrongly) as a dreaded 'hybrid' class. Groups generally do no want a hybrid class tanking. IBs will most likely be in very high demand.

[yarn ironthumb]

IBs will most likely be in very high demand.

sweet. IB's must be respected by groups of Order guys. :cool: But.. which class is most populair in order? which one will we see most? For all we know IB's are actually the most populair and half of the Order players is IB. :p ( wouldn't that be fun )

[Warmaster tibs]

Ironbreackers are the real TANK..

[Festo]

Ironbreakers are the real TANK..

QFT

and if anyone says its not truth i'll put a sign above your head saying HERESY and an arrow pointing down then tibs is gunna make you confess to sin



oh and tibs i fixed your spelling

[Logic Crash]

It looks like the WP might be the most popular Order class. We will probably see a good number of IB and WP running around in groups. Fitting I think, Sigmar would be proud I'm sure.

[Logic Crash]

Oops my bad.

[Mazari]

well

IB with no grudge = bunny with plastic axe

IB with max grudge = freaking monster that will split you in half with one blow

thats the difference in his power at min and at max