Undivided

[Laser]

I've got an idea amazingly enough:

About the fact that at the mo chaos have tezentch(sp?) when they do an expansion they should slowly change to have 4 classes for 4 gods and how?
well they just change tzeentch to undivied simple!
So what would each god's class be?

[MachiavelliDisciple]

Undivided really wouldn't work: if each class represented one god you'd only end up having a very simplified versions of the gods. This, I believe, is more reprehensible to chaos fans than just having the one. Besides, chaos undivided is a rare thing (canon wise) and given the scenario it makes more sense to have one god leading a war. Chaos only unites behind very powerful champions (as far as I'm aware it is only when the Everchosen appears that this happens, correct me if I'm wrong).

However if we did have undivided:

Champion of Nurgle: Melee defensive
Champion of Khorn: Melee offensive
Champion of Tzeentch: Magic class
Champion of Slaanesh: Not entirely sure

[Ralzar]

Heh, this has allready been suggested so many times it's starting to cause me physical pain to see it again :P

As the poster above me pointed out, it would simplify the gods a lot. Also, it would set up groups for allways being a mix of all gods worshippers being buddy-buddy and helping eachother out. Which I'd really prefer not to see too much off.
I realize we will probably see quite a bit of orc/DE/Chaos mixed groups, but it just feels extra iffy to have a Nurgle warrior tanking while the Khorne warrior does the damage, the Tzeench sorceror CCs while the Slaanesh pries heals them. Then I'd prefer if it was just Undivided, with no one actually following a particular god.

[Rammsoldat]

Grandfather nurgle would be displeased were I to aid the changer of ways. lol

Its an alright Idea but like has been said it would over simplify the gods and in the end to stand a chance agains foes with mixed classes and support id be foreced to break character and aide another chaos gods followers.

I plan to RP and it would bug the hell outta me. In the end id rather RP a warrior of tzeench for a while with full support classes than rp a Nurgle character who whas stuck on his own, im not saying nurgle characters should have healers as that would be odd but one of nurgles gifts is the ability to ignore pain wich could be a handy spell for a supporting caster class along with some offensive disease spells.

so yea id rather mythic take their time and do justice to the gods than rush to cram trimmed down versions in the game in an effort to please all right away. I have faith that they'll get the rest of the gods represented in due corse, an MMO has alot of lifespan after all.

[MachiavelliDisciple]

While I am an avid fan of chaos I do hope they intergrate completely new races rather than developing an original one. It would be great to play a nurgle champion some day but I'd rather see skaven, lizardmen, beastmen etc first. But as Mark Jacobs said:

Folks,

FYI, I would love to have all the Chaos gods just as I would love to have seen the Vampire Counts and the Skaven at release. Unlike some (not all) other developers we are setting realistic targets and not promising the world, sun and moon in order to attract attention from the fanbase. It would be really, really easy for us to do so and then, after we get close to release, tell players that we had to remove those things due to time constraints. It's a marketing/developer ploy that has been going on in the game industry forever. While we have, like every other developer, had to cut stuff out of the release version, we always believed that the material was intended to be in at release. We've learned a lot from DAoC and from Imperator and we think it is simply better to talk about what we intend to deliver at release as opposed to what we, in a perfect world, would love to be able to release. It makes for a happier fanbase and, who knows, maybe we'll find the time to throw some extra loving in as we get closer to the big day.

Mark

[Ralzar]

While I am an avid fan of chaos I do hope they intergrate completely new races rather than developing an original one. It would be great to play a nurgle champion some day but I'd rather see skaven, lizardmen, beastmen etc first. But as Mark Jacobs said:

Yeah, I really doubt we'll see the other chaos gods as playable down the road. It's not like Mythic can just keep adding stuff in for ever. I'd be VERY surprised if they ever managed to implemet all parts of the Warhammer world. So it's not a matter of which parts are implemented first, but what parts are included at all. And weighing the other races against doing chaos over again three more times, I have to go with new races.

[ConverseSC]

I think it's better to have players rally around one central figure, and in the case of Chaos, this figure should be a god. Undivided is a cool idea, but when your RvR enemy is the Empire, whom I'm assuming will only be represented by Sigmar followers, then you need to have an equal representative. The concept of a follower of chaos itself can be confusing, but whorshipping an "evil" god isn't. Players who aren't previously fans of the universe will understand the latter better.

Now, why is Tzeentch the best choice? Khorne is your typical blood-thirsty war god. Not incredibly unique, and his slot is pretty much taken up by Orcs (I realize the difference, but that doesn't change the preconception). Slaanesh won't be added due to obvious practical reasons. Nurgle...would be cool, but I'm assuming it will turn players off of Chaos. Tzeentch simply represents "chaos" best. Change.

I think adding races and content should be taken into consideration before adding the other gods. Hell, you could also add beastmen on a latter date, and give them Khorne to follow. Then Skaven pretty much get Nurgle-lite, and if you really want to get people whining, give the DEs a Slaanesh representative. Problem solved. ;)

[The_Deadpool]

As long as I can make my character look like a Khorne Berzerker, regardless of being a Tzeentchian or not.. I'm fine. :p

[Ralzar]

The concept of a follower of chaos itself can be confusing, but whorshipping an "evil" god isn't. Players who aren't previously fans of the universe will understand the latter better.



Hm, hadn't thought about that, but you're absolutely right. It makes sense to use a god as a focal point for the army. The concept of chaos is a bit too complex for a gamer with no Warhammer experience to really grasp.

[Rammsoldat]

Hm, hadn't thought about that, but you're absolutely right. It makes sense to use a god as a focal point for the army. The concept of chaos is a bit too complex for a gamer with no Warhammer experience to really grasp.

sigh i suppose it is right, tho i really hate it when things get dumbed down.

[Nurgle]

Yeah, I really doubt we'll see the other chaos gods as playable down the road. It's not like Mythic can just keep adding stuff in for ever. I'd be VERY surprised if they ever managed to implemet all parts of the Warhammer world. So it's not a matter of which parts are implemented first, but what parts are included at all. And weighing the other races against doing chaos over again three more times, I have to go with new races.

3 more times just for the other major Gods, 4 if you include Undivided, 5 if you include Beastmen. And on the extreme side of it, which will never happen 6 for daemon hosts, and 7 for the long dead Chaos Dwarfs.

I think the only other Chaos faction we have any chance of seeing is the Beastmen, I can see them being paired up with the Wood Elves.

[Chilltouch]

THE HELL?!

Chaos is not getting dumbed down at all.

Mythic is expanding on one God. That is not dumbing down.

Dumbing down is when you want to make a class per God.

"lawl nurgle r tuff so nurgle r tank kk? tzeench iz magikz so tzeench iz spellzorz lawl"

NO.

Want to know the possible classes available?


Khorne DPS
Khorne Tank
Nurgle DPS
Nurgle Tank
Nurgle Magic User
Slaanesh DPS
Slaanesh Tank
Slannesh Magic User
Tzeentch DPS
Tzeentch Tank
Tzeentch Magic User
Other stuff


Not every soldier of Tzeentch is magical.
Not every soldier of Nurgle is impossible to kill.
Not every soldier of Khorne excels at hurting people.
Not every soldier of Slaanesh is some wierd, support hybrid. Hell, no soldier of Slaanesh is. So where the do you people get the idea of "Oh, Slaanesh is support" from?!

Anyway. You can get Nurgle magic users, who spread plagues through unnatural means. You can have Khorne soldiers armed with gargantuan shields and tough, plate armour. You can have Tzeentchite assassins, armed with two long blades, who call upon Tzeentch for glimpses of the enemy's mind and their strategy.

PLEASE DO NOT DUMB DOWN THE GODS.

EXPAND ON ONE.

[Rammsoldat]

i was just refering to the "people who dont know warhammer may not understand chaos so just have 1 god" idea, i can understand it but i dont like it as in my eyes its dumbing the story down.

Its been said theres a good reason for having just tzeench avaidable so im gonna wait until everything has been cleared up.

[Nurgle]

i was just refering to the "people who dont know warhammer may not understand chaos so just have 1 god" idea, i can understand it but i dont like it as in my eyes its dumbing the story down.

Its been said theres a good reason for having just tzeench avaidable so im gonna wait until everything has been cleared up.


It does make more since to have just one god, if you think about it. The only time you have any kind of major Chaos problems is when they have an incursion out of the Chaos wastes. Which the story Mythic has told so far, here is a quote from there page

"The Age of Reckoning is ushered in as a Warhost of the god Tzeentch, the Changer of Ways, marches on the Empire. Leading this terrifying army of evil is a powerful Champion named Tchar'zanek. "

Beyond incursions, Chaos does not sit around in the Warhammer world. The only Chaos followers that do are Beastmen, and the Human Marauder tribes. So to stay in the Lore of Warhammer, the only real way to have a large Chaos pressence is with a incursion lead by a Champion. And that really narrows it down to stick with one Chaos faction, as it only tends to be a single faction that comes out to fight.

[Rammsoldat]

It does make more since to have just one god, if you think about it. The only time you have any kind of major Chaos problems is when they have an incursion out of the Chaos wastes. Which the story Mythic has told so far, here is a quote from there page

"The Age of Reckoning is ushered in as a Warhost of the god Tzeentch, the Changer of Ways, marches on the Empire. Leading this terrifying army of evil is a powerful Champion named Tchar'zanek. "

Beyond incursions, Chaos does not sit around in the Warhammer world. The only Chaos followers that do are Beastmen, and the Human Marauder tribes. So to stay in the Lore of Warhammer, the only real way to have a large Chaos pressence is with a incursion lead by a Champion. And that really narrows it down to stick with one Chaos faction, as it only tends to be a single faction that comes out to fight.


Bah i know it makes sense but all the sense dosent dull my disapointment. Ill see how everythng ends up before I commit to chaos.

[Joona]

Tzeentch is indeed probably the best option if it has to be one god, I personally prefer Khrone.

Oh and the colors! Blue and yellow.. makes me cry.

I want to be a loyal to my lord but I'd much gladly wear some more khorne stylish stuff than Tzeencth.

I also hope that as Tzeencth is God of Changes they add some other " mutations " where I can chose to not go for birdlike look and if possible without any magical skills what so ever. ( I've played so much casters role that I've just got enough of it. )

Undivied army would be kinda hard to make I guess, would be neat still..

[Vail]

Oh and the colors! Blue and yellow.. makes me cry.


I plan to dye myself tenticle pink and liche purple while yelling Slaves to Pleasure...or at least Blood Red and Burnished Gold and yelling Blood for the Blood God!... Not like they can "kick" me out of chaos for being chaotic :chaos:

[Vash108]

I for one would just like 2 throw my praise for not using Undivided. :D

[Kaikai]

personaly ive been collecting and reading and playing for a good many years, i'd say around mabey 12 or so.
i would rather they 'dumb down' the gods, than focus upon one.
i dont think its a case of dumbing down however, its specialising.

tzeentchs best magic users, khornes best warriors, nurgles best.. sick guys.
ect
that would have meaning, the player charicters are usally heros in mmorpgs, it wouldent be the case here since chaos is evil, but basicly if all chaos players were 'potential' champions, it makes sence to me.

alot more chaos fans would be happy with the chance to at least play alittle of their favourite god than have to play a possible god they did not like (lets face it, even though i would say tzeentch and slanessh are two of the least popular chaos gods that players like, even if you slip the chaos player pop in four, thats still only 1 in 4 chaos fans happy)

but its not gonna happen i suspect.
personaly id rather it was chaos undivided simply because its bloody rare for it to happen in warhammer fantasy.
its EPIC, its big, its a real piece of living (warhammer) history, and fans of chaos know how utterly dangerious the idea of a undivided warband on the scale we are talking about, would really be.

[Gharunkal]

That only Tzeentch is playable, doesn''t means that other Gods aren't completely in it, just not playable. I as an avid fan of Tzeentch am of course happy he is in it, but would you think there will be no sign of Khorne, Nurgle or Slaanesh?

My answer sounds: "No, there will be small groups following the other Gods, and even Deamons, but they just won't be playable. Just NPC's." I make this up from Mythic's answers and even that I saw a model of a plaguebearer deamon.

Tzeentch just makes it easier as a playable race. Of all Gods, the Tzeentch stick the close to sanity, though normal humans would refer to Tzeentch as manical. Certainly for RP it would be more interesting to play a plotting sinister magician, than a berserk frenzy warrior of Khorne who can only yell: "Blood for the blood God!"

Slaanesh is left out because, just look at the models, would cause the age rating go up BIG time, lots of boobs, orchies etcetera. Nurgle would be non-appealing to new players. People who never heard of Nurgle wouldn't like to play a lad with tumors, pus streaming over his body.

What we get from the other Gods are NPC's to set our rivalry with. Nonetheless, there are models from Beastmen in it as well, that tells us the other races which aren't playable are in it.

[Vash108]

The other gods will be present in the game and that means all of them even the Dark Prince. They will be just NPC characters.

Mark Jacobs said himself of all the things he would want to put into the game, but set realistic goals for things to put out on release. No doubt in my mind that down the road you will see some PCs bearing the marks of other gods.

For the dark prince issue they would just have to change a few clothing/armor details to put them in the game. It can be done, just with some artistic license.

[Oak]

Not every soldier of Tzeentch is magical.
Not every soldier of Nurgle is impossible to kill.
Not every soldier of Khorne excels at hurting people.
Not every soldier of Slaanesh is some wierd, support hybrid. Hell, no soldier of Slaanesh is. So where the do you people get the idea of "Oh, Slaanesh is support" from?!

I disagree, one wouldn't be a follower of Khorne if he didn't excel at that. ;)

[Brass Soul]

Personally, I could live with Tzeentch running the war.

It appears that the plague is akin to the skill in the Tzeentch magic that turns people into Horrors of Tzeentch.

Historically, in both the 40k and Fanatasy Chaos, although nobody really *likes* Tzeentch, he is most often the one that brokers peace long enough for the Legions/Hordes to get moving to bigger and better things, even if such alliances don't last forever.

And frankly, as long as I can make my Slaaneshi Chaos Warrior (with the attendant colours and themes, although they don't have to fit identically with the Table Top), I could care less who I work for.

Slaves are slaves! And I need more bodies to practice flagellation on. Bring forth, the LASH OF TORMENT!
:twisted:

[ConverseSC]

The way I see it is, we normally would have expected for them to have gone with either Khorne or Undivided. Personally, I love the fact that they choose to really flesh out one "god" rather than going the predictable route. I wouldn't have seen a Nurgle Tank or Khorne DPS'er as "dumbing the gods down" at all, because it simply highlights their strengths. I just don't think it would have been as cool of a concept, if the Chaos faction didn't focus on one god. Like the Empire lives in reverence of Sigmar, so can Chaos have a single figure to identify with. Instead of a bunch of conflicting quests pertaining to the wishes on all four gods, then general quests can be more streamlined and pertain to one god's "great plan". You know, so we can actually feel like a unified force?

Besides, you have to think of the doors this opens. This leaves Khorne, Nurgle, and Slaanesh open for epic PvE story-arcs. If everyone one on the same "team", we wouldn't be able to have some hot chaos-on-chaos action. You wouldn't be able to send your sword through the skull of some Nurgle-worshipping beastman. You wouldn't be able to down a Daemonette while drooling on your keyboard. Can you imagine this game without 40-man raids on a Bloodthirsty (;))? I certainly can't.

[Kraus]

I am really tempted to lock this thread just on the fact its been done to death and then a necrophilliac found it anyways... :P Dont expect to be able to make a Slaneesh warrior, but you can RP one if you want. It would kind of defeat the purpose to basically make a Slaneesh look alike Tzeentch worshipper.

Highlighting their strengths is something that can kinda be understood by people familiar with it, but for the people that will be new to Warhammer (I expect most of the populance) it would simply kill any depth to the god... Its alot more solid to develop it from one god. Undivided isnt that common is it?

And you can fight against Bloodthirsters, yep: P

[Brass Soul]

Yeah, pretty much I could only RP the Slaaneshi. Slaanesh worshippers aren't too choosy about who supplies to slaves (Slaves to Slaanshi is the equivalent of currency), and all I would need would be some sort of colour-customization option on the armour, in which any of the brighter colours with a sharp contrast would suffice. I'm willing to do a little suspension of blief. After all, I'm not going for mage-y-ness, I want to hack foes apart in the name of the Dark Prince! Warfare is an aspect of ambition, and there is no better place to test your mettle than in competition with those who believe you weak to pay homage to your God.

And I could always do a concept toon! (Hooray for self-gimpage in the name of being as clost to source as possible!)

[Smachaz]

A cooler way would be, to choose your god (your appearance) then your class, but noyt classes could be chosen (no Khorne mages..ect.)

[Kraus]

Been discussed and shot down alraedy on that, it doesnt give personality and works against the fluff.

[Commentaris]

gonna be great making fun of the khornate fanatics in their tzeentchian armour, died bloodred, pretending to be a berzerker tbh.

all the dye in the world isn;t gonna make the warrior in the concept art look any less tzeentchian. he's covered in swirls, engraved eyes, the tzeentch mark, bird and feather motives, etc.

[Ralzar]

all the dye in the world isn;t gonna make the warrior in the concept art look any less tzeentchian. he's covered in swirls, engraved eyes, the tzeentch mark, bird and feather motives, etc.

Not to mention that you'll be serving Tzeench in all your quests and actions.

[Nathar]

And if mutations are in it'll be an even greater laugh. Nurgle guys running around, completely clean but with wings and a bird head. Khornates who have mage abilities. Slaaneshi worshippers who with eyes all over.... and no tentacles. I would have to laugh at them.

And Tzeentch aimed skills and spells. I really hope people will just give in. Just like I hope there will be no cold one knight pretending to be an assassin. Be what you play, and make it work;)