We wanted Runesmiths, what we got are cloth-wearing fatties with sticks.

[Warfield]

What table-top fans wanted were Rune-SMITHS; hammer in one hand, rune-staff in the other, geared for battle with mail tunics, breastplates, jewelled helms, bringing down bolts of lightning and fireballs on the enemy...

What we got instead were cloth-wearing fatties with sticks.

With all the skilled blacksmiths found in each and every hold, Dwarfs shouldn't enter battle wearing cloth, unless there is a sturdy breastplate or coat of mail underneath.


I am *really* disappointed with the look of this career so far... Paul, do something! :-x

[Lynx]

Agree.

Im not really impressed with runepriests or engineers...

- Lynx :bwolves:

[Dog]

"OMG two people dont like the carrers !!!! Quickly unbalance the game screw up hours of work make the game suck just to keep these two guys happy"

Yeah not gona happen they've probably worked hard to balance the gameplay out and by the looks of things they are doing quite well.

[arthurfoxshot]

I dont think they are in light weight armour,since it says there in medium,but the sceenshots look like there in cloth,but still its not just normal cloth armour it has runes on it i guess:p
Also i don't think it says anything about them being able to craft armour which is abit disappointing

[ConverseSC]

"OMG two people dont like the carrers !!!! Quickly unbalance the game screw up hours of work make the game suck just to keep these two guys happy"

Yeah not gona happen they've probably worked hard to balance the gameplay out and by the looks of things they are doing quite well.

Dog, while I'm all for inappropriate sarcasm and general jackassery, I must admit that what you've said here really doesn't make much sense. They're complaining about the look and style of a career. How exatcly is that related to balance? How exactly will making the Dwarf class more "authentic" suddenly make the game "suck"?

Then again, I want my Dwarf to have a sword, so I guess I shouldn't be the one defending the image of "authentic" Dwarfs. :)

[Gahn]

I would play em before saying u ain't impressed, seem both 2 solid classes from my pov :o

[Cranmer]

The class itself sounds interesting for me but their look could be a bit improved. Giving them metal helmets would be nice for example...

[dutch_gamer]

I dont think they are in light weight armour,since it says there in medium,but the sceenshots look like there in cloth,but still its not just normal cloth armour it has runes on it i guess:p
Also i don't think it says anything about them being able to craft armour which is abit disappointing

When you look at the art, you will see that they only wear "no armor" (cloth) in the beginning. The Tier 4 armor clearly shows more than just cloth. They will probably start out wearing cloth and then can start wearing mail armor when you progress your character.

And to the OP, since when is the Runesmith anything like a mage? Dwarfs don't shoot lightning or fireballs. So no wonder you aren't impressed, since you were expecting to get a mage. Dwarfs are basically anti-magic. So I think you don't really speak for the majority of the Warhammer TT fans. Since Runesmiths have never been had real magic. And no, a Rune of Fire isn't the same as a fireball.

And also why should it say anything about the Runepriest being able to craft armor? They aren't blacksmith you know. Runepriests craft Runes, that is a huge difference from crafting something like armor.

With all the skilled blacksmiths found in each and every hold, Dwarfs shouldn't enter battle wearing cloth, unless there is a sturdy breastplate or coat of mail underneath.

Look at the Runepriest info page and read the line where it says they will wear MEDIUM armor. That is the exact same armor they list for the Hammerer, so that is possibly mail armor. What you have been looking at is the art, to show the different Tiers. Others games make you start out in lower armor as well at times. You can't go all out with just a "level 1". And really, that every hold thing is an exaggeration on your part. Slayers don't wear that kind of stuff either and they are still Dwarfs, who still are a part of the Dwarf army when in need.

I have got the feeling you have got a different view of the Dwarfs than what they truly are. GW and Mythic can't please someone who thinks that Dwarfs are something else than what they are in the lore. Runepriests are "lower" on the scale than Runesmiths, so they wear armor that is a level lower, medium armor. And again, Runesmiths, etc, aren't mages or wizards.

[Seldaren]

Where does the idea come from that Runesmiths run around in platemail breastplates?

All the stuff I've been able to find on the web you can't really tell what they're wearing, as the beards are too long.

Does this guy have a metal breastplate?
http://uk.games-workshop.com/dwarfs/miniature-gallery/3/

Can't tell. The beard is in the way.

Or this guy?
http://www.coolminiornot.com/108302

Again, can't really tell. But that doesn't look like metal armor. Metal helmet obviously though.

There are a couple new screenies of Runepriests in the Gamespot Interview with Steve Martin. I think they look fine to be honest.

If anything, you can probably consider the Runepriests to be wearing robes over top of chainmail.

Seldaren

[Baron Khaine]

Did you ever think they could be wearing arnour underneath there robes? If the class armour is medium (which is as mentioned before, the same as hammerers) that could mean that they wear mail. Personally I don't think the runepriest will need much armour, if they inscribe there armour with the armour runes

[Adendan]

I really don't see anything wrong with runepriests. Seems like a good solid class.
And yeah, as mentioned a few times before; they are listed as wearing medium armor.
Now I personally wouldn't call cloth medium armor, especially not after looking at the Hammerer screenshots and seeing that they, too, wear medium armor

[Eldrik]

I think Runepriests look cool, im gonna be one.

[Snorri]

Yes.
Let us give all the dwarf classes heavy. heavy, Gromil armour and powerfully runed weapons of the likes only heroes are supposed to hold.
Let us completly overpower the other races, who cares about unbalancing an MMO? Let us make runepriests as tough as Ironbreakers and as lethal as Hammerers.

It would be far more complicated to sort balance out in any other way than restricting armour.

Actually... that doesnt sound to bad...hmmm ;)

[Warfield]

Actually, Runesmiths can use Anvils of Doom which do cast lightning and fireballs. Also, they do wear mail and breastplates (even if they don't make it themselves). Having said that... the point I am trying to make is that the look of the runepriests are a let down from what fans of the table-top expected.

The look of the class isn't very Dwarfish. He doesn't look fit for battle, rather he looks like a wizard and that's exactly the problem...

[Bloodstorm]

Agree.

Im not really impressed with runepriests or engineers...
- Lynx :bwolves:


Eh, wots all this now?

[Rurik]

Hmm, well I plan on making an Ironbreaker and a Runpriest as a secondary. Looking back at some of the screenshots and concept art for Runies I have mixed feelings.

This guy, for example, looks badass:

http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/gameInfo/armiesofWAR/Dwarfs/Careers/images/Runepriest04.jpg

While this guy looks like he should have a pink drink with an umbrella in it:

http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/gameInfo/armiesofWAR/Dwarfs/Careers/images/Runepriest03.jpg

That said, that same design rendered isnt so bad:

http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/gameInfo/armiesofWAR/Dwarfs/Careers/images/Runepriest06.jpg
http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/gameInfo/armiesofWAR/Dwarfs/Careers/images/Runepriest05.jpg

I think they need to tone down the colors a bit - more in line with Mr. Badass in the first link.

And these staffs look outstanding:

http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/media/conceptArt/full/062006_CA_04.jpg


So what am I saying? I dunnno, I just seem to be posting a lot of links ... but the basic concept of the Runepriest sounds good to me - an old codger (or young codger for that matter) that mumbles a lot, puts the good mojo on armor and axes, does the 'laying on of hands' routine to heal buddies, and can still clobber a goblin on his own. Sounds great really.

- Rurik

[Bloodstorm]

So what am I saying? I dunnno, I just seem to be posting a lot of links ... but the basic concept of the Runepriest sounds good to me - an old codger (or young codger for that matter) that mumbles a lot, puts the good mojo on armor and axes, does the 'laying on of hands' routine to heal buddies, and can still clobber a goblin on his own. Sounds great really.

- Rurik

Hehe, this man has it.

[Snorri]

Actually, Runesmiths can use Anvils of Doom which do cast lightning and fireballs. Also, they do wear mail and breastplates (even if they don't make it themselves). Having said that... the point I am trying to make is that the look of the runepriests are a let down from what fans of the table-top expected.

The look of the class isn't very Dwarfish. He doesn't look fit for battle, rather he looks like a wizard and that's exactly the problem...

I know they use anvils of doom, and I know traditionally they wear metal armour and wield hammers. Engineers have also been known to wear sturdy metal armour and wield hammers.
My point is, that unfortunately, changes have to made to balance a MMO.

[Xeres]

I see the Rune Priest as one of those Hybrid classes. They can both support and dish out some damage. This is going to be a class that takes some time to master and play correctly. As was stated before they don't have any problems with them and they are a good class. They are meant to be a hybrid class and not pure damage in my opinion.

I personally am going to play it for a challenge =P

[Warfield]

Runepriests already have the same armor rating as Hammerers, so the issue is not about balance...

What I am suggesting is that they LOOK like the runesmith tabletop figures, which they don't - and I know it's by design since part of mythic's RvR system is making enemy careers easily identifiable.

However, I have a problem with it because I am an avid Warhammer Dwarf fan and I think that cloth-wearing Dwarfs (magically-enchanced or otherwise) have no place on the battlefield.

[Quazar]

Those guys in the pictures are wearing armor. Chainmail on one, the over could be leather/chainmail/plate. So restricting to cloth would be dumb. Thankfully that's not what they're gonna do. Just like the Warrior Priest begins in cloth the Runepriest will too. It's not a big deal.

[Kraus]

I wish to point out to anyone that says they arent dwarfish; the ONLY person group and what not that is qualified to say anything WH related is not WH Dwarf enough really is GW, who would of gave the okay. :P

I'm agreeing that they have to make sure classes look iconic; Engineers stand out as engineers from a distance, hammerers look like hammeres, ironbreakers look like ironbreakers.. Runepriests cant look like hammerers with staves, they stand out alot more in cloth or more priestly looking armor. They wont be stuck in just cloth tho, thats good. :P

[Julius]

Runepriests already have the same armor rating as Hammerers, so the issue is not about balance...

What I am suggesting is that they LOOK like the runesmith tabletop figures, which they don't - and I know it's by design since part of mythic's RvR system is making enemy careers easily identifiable.

However, I have a problem with it because I am an avid Warhammer Dwarf fan and I think that cloth-wearing Dwarfs (magically-enchanced or otherwise) have no place on the battlefield.
1. Runesmiths wear cloth over their armour. Probably as a sign of their status or something like that. They also carry staffs since that's the image GW wants to put acros now. (Check the new army book)
2. The pictures are probably of starterlevel dwarfs, or maybe midlevel. Anyway, judging a class from a few pictures is kinda useless, since you don't know if they might get changed a lil bit.

You can't make runesmiths start with heavy gromril armour since it takes a lot of years before an apprentice even becomes a runesmith. It's also balancewise immposible.

I think that high level runesmiths will be quite heavily armoured. Just like they should be. Not at a low level already.

[vehemoth]

I like the way the Runepriests have been developed here. I would also like to further emphasize that they are Medium armored scholars at the art of runecraft, in addition to being the brave front line supporting caster of the dwarven army. I believe your description of them is a gross over simplification ( south park teaches me how to communicate :o).

In order for the runepriest to effectively fill the supporting caster archetype it had to parallel the goblin shaman in its roles. What we have is a well implicated adaptation of tabletop characters into WAR. I'm excited to play a runepriest.

[Falcon]

You guys are trying to take too much information from the pictures. The pictures are drawn by artists and the game is still in alpha meaning everything can change. The artists get handed a page description and are told to draw this. They can be influnenced from doznes of different things and present misinformation or no information at all that you all hound over like mythic is trying to be cryptic and delve out information in a way not everyone would notice

[Smachaz]

Well if you look at that picture, you can see him wearing armor. Medium armor he has big iron boots metal bracers shoulders and a big metal belt. Althrough i agree that Runesmiths look cooler.

[checkthis5000]

1. Runesmiths wear cloth over their armour. Probably as a sign of their status or something like that. They also carry staffs since that's the image GW wants to put acros now. (Check the new army book)
2. The pictures are probably of starterlevel dwarfs, or maybe midlevel. Anyway, judging a class from a few pictures is kinda useless, since you don't know if they might get changed a lil bit.

You can't make runesmiths start with heavy gromril armour since it takes a lot of years before an apprentice even becomes a runesmith. It's also balancewise immposible.

I think that high level runesmiths will be quite heavily armoured. Just like they should be. Not at a low level already.

3. They're not runesmiths, they're an adapted class called runepriest. Which is probably why they don't have the helms and such. There will probably be runesmith NPCs in the game. The runepriest is a different beast altogether.

[Chilltouch]

You wanted runesmiths. And you got runepriests. You should be happy you got rune anything. You should be happy there is even a WHFB MMORPG.

Stop whining and carry on sucking on that goblin phallus, my dwarfy friends.

[Duerghaul]

You wanted runesmiths. And you got runepriests. You should be happy you got rune anything. You should be happy there is even a WHFB MMORPG.

Stop whining and carry on sucking on that goblin phallus, my dwarfy friends.

Aside from your completely useless flame of a "post", let me turn your attention to the recently released RvR video from the last newsletter:

http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/media/podcast/files/WAR-pp_2006-11_RvR.html

thats a whole lot of Greenskins getting stomped. Get use to that video, its going to happen alot after release.

PS. Goblins and Greenskins dont procreate. Ya aint got no Phallus, bub. You're a bunch of nancy eunuchs, and we're gonna stomp on ya like the nancy girls ya are.

[Warfield]

You wanted runesmiths. And you got runepriests. You should be happy you got rune anything. You should be happy there is even a WHFB MMORPG.

Stop whining and carry on sucking on that goblin phallus, my dwarfy friends.

Hey bub, this is a forum to discuss the game. If I don't like the way the runepriest is fleshed out, then that's my opinion and you better believe I am going to express it. If you think that someone expressing an opinion that is different from yours is "whining" then perhaps it's just best to leave the thread alone and go be "constructive" somewhere else. There's no need to be insulting.

Dwarfs without armor on the battlefield shatters my perception of Warhammer Dwarfs and I am disappointed it was approved by Games Workshop. Robed Dwarfs in a temple or at a ceremony INSIDE the safety of their hold, sure... faced with crazed orcs and goblins on the battlefield, I never thought I'd see it.

I certainly hope that the Runepriest armor at Tier 4 has more metal in it or consists of a robe/mail combo along the lines of a warrior-priest. It just makes more sense that a race who is known for its metal-work would outfit it's fighters appropriately for war.

[Gor]

only read the first few posts so dunno if this has been said but:

Its a pvp/rvr game first and a warhammer game second.

after you get that through your head, realize a high priority goal stated by more than one of the mythic higher ups: SILHOUETTING.

that means a caster, looks like a caster. a tank, looks like a tank. and a hybrid - a runepriest for instance, looks like a hybrid. get your boardgame "looks" out of your head, the classes in this game are going to fit a certain archetype (or at least a mixture of them) so that one can immediately tell what they are. class identification is a very important aspect of a pvp game and one mythic has said they aren't going to make deceptive in WAR.

[Warfield]

only read the first few posts so dunno if this has been said but:

Its a pvp/rvr game first and a warhammer game second.

after you get that through your head, realize a high priority goal stated by more than one of the mythic higher ups: SILHOUETTING.

that means a caster, looks like a caster. a tank, looks like a tank. and a hybrid - a runepriest for instance, looks like a hybrid. get your boardgame "looks" out of your head, the classes in this game are going to fit a certain archetype (or at least a mixture of them) so that one can immediately tell what they are. class identification is a very important aspect of a pvp game and one mythic has said they aren't going to make deceptive in WAR.If you read the entire thread, you would have seen that this has already been pointed out twice (by myself and by Kraus). Personally, I feel that silhouetting can still be accomplished without throwing a sheet with small epaulets on a Dwarf.

[versuvius]

hmm i think it may have to be a blanket a sheet isnt wide enough

[Ruriktheoneeye]

Im a dwarf player. I dont mean TT i dont mean MMO i play dwarves everywhere and anywhere they are offered. As far as GW is concerned they are dwarves with armour on the battlefields massive battles. I dont know if this going to be the general case in this game if it is up the armour on everyone no one goes to battle with less then their best on.


Now for general adventuring and wandering around i think a cloth/mail/plate hybrid or evolution is great for these runepriest things(They arent the Runesmiths us table top players know and love).

Anything else i might have to say is just repeating what has been said.

P.S. Sillouhetting aside there shouldnt be any dwarves wearing robes for general wear out in the field. Any one have a good idea on silhoutteing rune priest with out making them look like namby pamby cloth wearers?