Female chosen!

[Disco_Dante]

allllllritey then folks! So seeing as there will be female chosen, what are they gonna look like? Do you think we are going to end up with skanky lingerie-armor that couldnt stop a cool breeze? Or will they be battle-armored she-devils from the BOWELS OF HELL! Or maybe even skanky lingerie-armored she-devils?

Personally I'd prefer the second option. Basically a male chosen with a few more curves. I like the realistic look more. However thats not to say that there shouldnt be a kinky lingerie shop somewhere. Screw that teen rating!

[Ralzar]

They'll be big walking, spikey, metal hulks.

With boobs.

[Krulltak]

http://www.warhammeralliance.com/gallery/showimage.php?i=455&c=5 This is what they should look like.

Unless you follow Slaanesh, or you're a Witch Elf, chainmail bikinis have no place in Warhammer. This is a dark and wartorn world full of grimness and grittyness.

[Memnos]

Go to www.warhammeronline.com (http://www.warhammeronline.com) and go to the concept sketches. It'll show female chosen, there. They're remarkably sedate compared to the Witch Elf(Which, by the way, I'm going to come right out and say look awesome compared to the Witch Elf models. Despite the irritating prevalence of 13 year old boys playing them, I have nothing but respect for the idea of a Maenad-like cannibal woman), with a solid and respectful cast. A previous person said they'd be walking armoured hulks with boobs. They will be.

[DeathsHorizon]

Yep yep yep, they are gonna be armored, hulking, battle babes...
Sweet, sweet blood frenzied hotness...

[Disco_Dante]

They'll be big walking, spikey, metal hulks.

With boobs.

sorry guys, ralzar wins

[Ralzar]

Go to www.warhammeronline.com (http://www.warhammeronline.com) and go to the concept sketches. It'll show female chosen, there. They're remarkably sedate compared to the Witch Elf(Which, by the way, I'm going to come right out and say look awesome compared to the Witch Elf models. Despite the irritating prevalence of 13 year old boys playing them, I have nothing but respect for the idea of a Maenad-like cannibal woman), with a solid and respectful cast. A previous person said they'd be walking armoured hulks with boobs. They will be.

What? I think you're confusing the Magus or Zealot with Chosen.

This is a female Magus: http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/media/conceptArt/full/112006_cart_03.jpg

This is a female Zealot: http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/media/conceptArt/full/12192006_18.jpg


I've yet to see any released pictures of a female Chosen. But I'd expect her to look as the male Magus looks compared to the male chosen.

[Krulltak]

Ummmm, yall did see my link of Jack's fan art, right? While not official, it looks top notch anyway.

[Ralzar]

Ummmm, yall did see my link of Jack's fan art, right? While not official, it looks top notch anyway.

Allthough it IS a nice piece of work, I hope Chosen don't actually look like that ingame. Way too high T&A factor.

[The_Deadpool]

No offense to Jack, I think it's a nice drawing but I don't like the look of that Chosen either. There's a little bit too much curves.. but then again, the face comes across as a half-woman/half-man with boobs. The face is too manly, just with bigger lips. I don't like the whole androgynous look. I think they should have the option to look somewhat pretty/good-looking to somewhat bad-looking. But they should still resemble a woman.

[Baron of Chaos]

Meh who cares if its not packing its a women.

[The_Deadpool]

I'd rather see an actual woman than an androgynous she-male for female chosen. Just because it's Chaos doesn't mean their women are hideous or look like brutish, smaller men with big lips and longer hair.

[Krulltak]

Well you know deadpool..........go find a picture of a Nordic woman, tell me if she looks androgenous. If she does, then the drawing makes perfect sense.

[The_Deadpool]

I have never seen a "Nordic woman", nor am I going to be able to find a good picture of one. But I know that they aren't ugly brutes. Every culture has their fair share of good-looking and ugly woman, so just saying their nordic means nothing. Though, I doubt many of them are androgynous. Considering that even 'ugly' women still look like women.

[Krulltak]

Well, hokay, I've seen Nordic woman and their pretty hot, so I guess you won that. But......this argument, I have come to the conclusion of.

You see, you assumed that by that one fanart that the artist would think that all chaos warriors are big brutes, even the females. However, it's just one character, and all the other female warriors look like, well,themselves. Some might be "hot", others might be "man-women" etc.

BUT, even still, as you move through the ranks of Chaos you become more powerful. While Tzeentch grants mainly the power of magic, that doesn't mean he won't give his people some muscle as well. Therefore, the females who rise through the ranks of Chaos also gain that muscle, giving the perfect reason why a female chosen would look "manly"......persay.

[Boulvae]

I've seen woman with alota muscle on em, and most of the time they did not look...well, I can only describe it as they DID look manly but alot of things about them was quite different. The only thing that was actually feminine about them was the hips plus the way they act and thats about it.

[Nerror]

I am hoping for something fairly subdued in the boob department. I found some pictures of women in plate armor.

http://swordmaiden.com/armor/eichling/ (favourite)
http://swordmaiden.com/armor/melanie/
http://swordmaiden.com/armor/merchants/

Nothing bigger than that. Hinting at the female form is fine, anything more and it's just for show and wouldn't really fit with the (non-slaanesh) chaos women IMO. It takes all of 3 seconds to find boobs on the intarweb, I don't need to see them ingame, except where it's lore-appropriate.

[Boulvae]

I always figured that the big breasts atachment to the plate all for more flexible movement without being restricted by two lumps of flesh and possibly scraping against it, but yeah thats cool.

[Aqe]

How much of the face can you actualy see ?? not much so why complain it looks just perfectly normal (for chaos)

[Juke]

This thread is getting me all excited.

In a purely platonic way, of course.

The important thing is they're chaos, so I'm sure no matter how masculine or feminine they are, it'll be friggin' brutal.

[Pen]

Slight hint of curves, I'd say, nothing like a Night Elf from WoW, but, something to let you know its a lady.

Maybe have a helmet-slit so the hair comes out of the back, maybe. But, I don't want to see a Female Chosen that looks like Samus Aran. :P

[XShrike]

I will be a little annoyed if the female Chosens' armor looks like a metal wet-suit. I will be pissed if they have those damn armor bikinis (http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b54/XShrike/ArmorClass.jpg) some games have. That stuff drives me up a wall.

You can have your armor lingerie but, your armor value should account for how little of you is covered.

[Goshin]

I read the title and blanched, but after looking at concept art and the overal opinion here, i'm excited to see female armored warriors done right.

Metal short shorts and mini skirts are lame.

[Flamingwonky]

Lame though it may be to you fluff-followers, I don't believe the red-blooded concept artists and particularly marketing boys at Mythic can resist high T&A factor in their female Chosen. Jack's fan art looks accurate.

[Ralzar]

Lame though it may be to you fluff-followers, I don't believe the red-blooded concept artists and particularly marketing boys at Mythic can resist high T&A factor in their female Chosen. Jack's fan art looks accurate.

They've been resisting just fine so far. The only women who seem to be showing any skin or clinging clothing seems to be the cloth-wearers.

http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/media/conceptArt/full/112006_cart_03.jpg

http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/media/conceptArt/full/1006Emp03.jpg

http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/media/conceptArt/full/12192006_19.jpg


Notice in particular the last one. It's a female Knight of the Blazing Sun, the Empires answer to the Tzeenchian Chosen.

[Finnblood]

Well, as it is The Chosen Warrior of Chaos, I would like to see more muscle than is normal to women. Seen the female bodybuilder contests? Something like that.
If you want to swing a big sword all day long, you'll need muscles.
But slighter build than the male version, so you can tell the difference with the armour on.

The face... well, I'd like to have options to make it feminine and pretty or East German Shot Putter -esque. Living in the Nordic area I know we have as much pretty and as much mmm... "not that pretty" people as any other nation. The current female concept for chaos women looks suitably deadly, yet beautiful.

Keep the wicked, cruel and cunning looks. They really suit Tzeentch, IMO.
Though I'd love to have options for more twisted types, such as albino, unnatural eye-colour, the eyes having different colours, small fangs etc. Tzeentchy stuff. :mrgreen:

[Spoonie]

I agree, chaos powers aside, you can't be one of the strongest, toughest, most mutated, most feared warriors in the known world and be "pretty", regardless of gender. However, because it's a game and I'm sure neither guys nor girls want their character to look like a she-male, they'll crank up the feminine meter a little bit. The concept art for that warrior priest and knight are spot on, still a pretty girl face, but not ginormous armored boobs or less armor than a male of the exact same class for no reason other than to attract 15 year olds to your game, but still with a few curves to show right away it's still a girl under there.

[Nerror]

I agree, chaos powers aside, you can't be one of the strongest, toughest, most mutated, most feared warriors in the known world and be "pretty", regardless of gender.

Like this? :rolleyes:

http://www.gagreport.com/Funny_Pictures/Freaky%20People/freaky_muscle_lady.jpg
http://www.gagreport.com/Funny_Pictures/Freaky%20People/muscle_woman.jpg

Or a guy: http://www.gagreport.com/Funny_Pictures/Freaky%20People/muscle_man.jpg

[Feigro]

Funny thing popped into my head while reading this thread;

There could be simple explanation for no female Chosen... Tzeentch changed them all into men. ;)

The horror that is Chaos!

[Krulltak]

Funny thing popped into my head while reading this thread..

There could be simple explanation for no female Chosen... Tzeentch changed them all into men. ;)

The horror that is Chaos!


Says the Order player.


Also, Chaos isn't sexist nor racist. If ye be servin da gods, and ye be strong, ye get what ye be deservin.

[Feigro]

[QUOTE=Krulltak;254882]Says the Order player.


Also, Chaos isn't sexist nor rh.

[Noli me Tangere]

Like this? :rolleyes:

http://www.gagreport.com/Funny_Pictures/Freaky%20People/freaky_muscle_lady.jpg
http://www.gagreport.com/Funny_Pictures/Freaky%20People/muscle_woman.jpg

Or a guy: http://www.gagreport.com/Funny_Pictures/Freaky%20People/muscle_man.jpg

Those people look like balloons that have grown some sort of human-shaped fungus on top of them. I was curious though what Nordic women would look like, so I did a bit of research. The results I came up with were surprisingly just what you'd expect (Or at least what I expected). Many of different types of women; they had various looks some smaller, others larger, some fairer, some darker, and some more pleasant looking than others. All sorts, no one model that defines all.

Just like what you'd find anywhere else in the world.

[Vrugar]

Like this? :rolleyes:

http://www.gagreport.com/Funny_Pictures/Freaky%20People/freaky_muscle_lady.jpg
http://www.gagreport.com/Funny_Pictures/Freaky%20People/muscle_woman.jpg

Or a guy: http://www.gagreport.com/Funny_Pictures/Freaky%20People/muscle_man.jpg

The first and thrid picture you linked don't look right, they look like fakes and not very good ones at that.

[Rotgut_Eadsmasha]

If you want an idea on what the female Chosen might look like, look at the female Warrior Priest.

None of the "Steel Bikini" BS that other MMO has. The female Chosen would probably look like a woman, like the female Magus, and she'll be wearing armor that actually looks like fully-functioning armor bulit for a woman.

And they don't have to look like they're about to explode in a burst of muscle in order to look strong... they have the power of the Warp surging through their bodies so they don't need a over abundance of muscle mass. And if they did have a over abundance of muscle mass... they'll probably going to turn into a Spawn soon.

[DeathsHorizon]

Like this? :rolleyes:

http://www.gagreport.com/Funny_Pictures/Freaky%20People/freaky_muscle_lady.jpg
http://www.gagreport.com/Funny_Pictures/Freaky%20People/muscle_woman.jpg

Or a guy: http://www.gagreport.com/Funny_Pictures/Freaky%20People/muscle_man.jpg

Good God, my eyes..... it burns!!!

I dont expect to see much skin though really... they being warriors and what not with 500 pounds of armor on and stuff...

[Pytho]

Meh who cares if its not packing its a women.

Agreed.

If the men are ugly then so should the women, you can put on your makeup and do your hair in the Elf battlefront.

[Gollo]

Personally, I'm hoping they don't look too slender and petite. As long as they aren't little petite amazon looking women with huge swords and shields, I'm okay with whatever other features they have.

I actually kind of like the idea of a slit in the back of their helm for hair >.> I don't know why.

[Eltharyon]

I believe I have something interesting to add to this thread.

At the GC Leipzig last year I asked Sanya what she thought about the PvP focus of the game and how it was going to affect female players. I figured a pure combat oriented game would turn female players off. She replied by simply stating that the hard thing was to get girls interested in the game, but once they were in they became some bloodthirsty PvP players.

She continued to explain that DAoC had one of the highest female to male player ratios of any MMORPG to to date and that she believed the reason was that the game featured "realistic" female character models. DAoC didn't feature any mostly exposed playmates as female characters but rather the everyday nice girl. Apparently this helped female players to identify with their characters.

If Mythic is still travelling on the same path they started years ago their female character models will never be like the scarcly clad sex objects in other games. I hope they do. I having some females in the guild chat. Makes a change from the sausagefest ;)

[Nextrodaet]

Speaking as a woman, I'll let you know what I think. :)

I want to see this (http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/media/conceptArt/full/WARca0207_17.jpg) but with loads more spikes, blood, nastyness and evil. I like this because she looks like she is wearing armor that actually would function and the look on her face speaks of being battle-hardened. You could say that she is pretty, but I doubt that's what you'll be thinking as she knocks you over the head with her hammer. Chaos women in general, should follow this sort of rule. Oh, certainly - they have certain aspects to them that are pretty but it in no way detracts from the fact that they are evil killing machines.

I'm fine with my female chaos zealot foaming at the mouth, charging madly into the fray and causing devastation. I suppose that with Chaos women, they should try to give the impression that they once were beautiful - I think that would be so much better than going to one extreme or the other. Show them as they are - the fallen and corrupted people of the world. Give me women with unbrushed hair, foaming mouthes and a crazed look in their eyes who facially, could be said to have once been pretty. That's the way to go if you ask me.

Summary: Give me chaos women who give the impression that they used to be beautiful before they fell to the dark powers. :)

[SonofHorus]

Speaking as a woman, I'll let you know what I think. :)

I want to see this (http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/media/conceptArt/full/WARca0207_17.jpg) but with loads more spikes, blood, nastyness and evil. I like this because she looks like she is wearing armor that actually would function and the look on her face speaks of being battle-hardened. You could say that she is pretty, but I doubt that's what you'll be thinking as she knocks you over the head with her hammer. Chaos women in general, should follow this sort of rule. Oh, certainly - they have certain aspects to them that are pretty but it in no way detracts from the fact that they are evil killing machines.

I'm fine with my female chaos zealot foaming at the mouth, charging madly into the fray and causing devastation. I suppose that with Chaos women, they should try to give the impression that they once were beautiful - I think that would be so much better than going to one extreme or the other. Show them as they are - the fallen and corrupted people of the world. Give me women with unbrushed hair, foaming mouthes and a crazed look in their eyes who facially, could be said to have once been pretty. That's the way to go if you ask me.

Summary: Give me chaos women who give the impression that they used to be beautiful before they fell to the dark powers. :)

Well...Considering that she's a Chaos Chosen, she'll probably have a helmet at all time..so there's probably little to determent how she looks.

[Destruction & Order]

I swear everybody in this community is forgetting something. You know its just a sketch of a potential char. I mean everybody seems to forget there has to be some type of char customization. On girls that could be how big the so called "T&A" is so that if you want little you get little if you want alot you get well what you want... Without char customization there would be chosen females that all look the same. I highly doubt that will be happening.

[AlienOverlord]

Ummmm, yall did see my link of Jack's fan art, right? While not official, it looks top notch anyway.

Love that piece. If Mythic gets something close to that I'll be a happy camper.

[TheDeinonychus]

Honestly, girls seem to be lacking in alot of things in Warhammer. True this is probably cause most of the player base for GW's games are guys, and while there are some women (Sisters of Battle, Dark Elf Witchelves, Sisters of Sigmar, and a few special characters) they have yet to put out a female version of every troop type that could possibly be female (And no more debates about female space marines! >.<)

As has been said by the Great and Insane Paul Barnett, women in Warhammer are more than capable of takeing care of themselves. There realy is no reason why any woman, ugly or not, couldnt devote herself to the Chaos gods and become a powerful Chosen. Now, would she stay pretty or would she devolve into an ugly, brutish hulk? Like all things involveing chaos, that's left up to the wit and whim of the gods. Slaanesh may decide that a female follower should degenerate into an obese, grotesque thing that perversely still finds herself beautiful. And equaly so Khorne may decide that a maiden of battle should the very image of feminine power and might.

But honestly, I think EA Mythic will likely go for the 'every day girl' look, like they did with the warpriests. No super-model figures, but no bulgey weight-lifters. Im sure character customization will have alot to do with that though, but it remains to be seen just how far you can customize your base looks. Still, Im eager to see just what EA Mythic will do with the female chosen.

And yes, I am working on a unit of female 'beastmen', just cause...

[thePREdiger]

http://www.warhammeralliance.com/gallery/showimage.php?i=455&c=5 This is what they should look like.

Unless you follow Slaanesh, or you're a Witch Elf, chainmail bikinis have no place in Warhammer. This is a dark and wartorn world full of grimness and grittyness.

wow nice one - if they look like this I will definatly consider playing one :D

[Arijharn]

That picture of the muscle guy screams fake to me... looks like he would crush a space marine with a locking of his limbs... God forbid whoever he is making 'love' too.

That's the kinda guy that makes me think his skeleton would be pulled apart by excessive movements lol.

As for female appearance, I think if they follow the concept for the warrior priest and knight, and engaged that same sort of... professionalism... to the other races, they'll do well.

[Aoann]

Speaking as a woman, I'll let you know what I think. :)

I want to see this (http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/media/conceptArt/full/WARca0207_17.jpg) but with loads more spikes, blood, nastyness and evil. I like this because she looks like she is wearing armor that actually would function and the look on her face speaks of being battle-hardened. You could say that she is pretty, but I doubt that's what you'll be thinking as she knocks you over the head with her hammer. Chaos women in general, should follow this sort of rule. Oh, certainly - they have certain aspects to them that are pretty but it in no way detracts from the fact that they are evil killing machines.

I'm fine with my female chaos zealot foaming at the mouth, charging madly into the fray and causing devastation. I suppose that with Chaos women, they should try to give the impression that they once were beautiful - I think that would be so much better than going to one extreme or the other. Show them as they are - the fallen and corrupted people of the world. Give me women with unbrushed hair, foaming mouthes and a crazed look in their eyes who facially, could be said to have once been pretty. That's the way to go if you ask me.

Summary: Give me chaos women who give the impression that they used to be beautiful before they fell to the dark powers. :)

here here sister!

[TaurenMoo]

... Ummm just a thought, but you realize that besides having a slightly smaller body and more curves a female chosen will slowly just as a male be required to enclose themselves completely in a metal casing known as their armor else their bodies ozz and poor out in a nasty spill of flesh blood and chaos... Chosen are chaos incarnate encased in metal... If anything a female starts off just like a male, normal body pretty feminine armor, hair, until slowly the armor is the only thing that shows she is even female ... maybe feminine curves in said armor order to keep some level of "beauty" that will always ride in the back of their chaotic minds... You might see the helmet showing a sign of a female, curved features of the face will make their way onto the helmet, the odvious breast features on the chest plate... a more slender body... metal ornate nails on the gauntlets...

[LastHeretic]

hey new to the forum but figured id best join to get my 2 cents in

personally i believe that though chaos they should be obv female, theres no point in starting a female char if its just gonna turn to the equivalent of very evil mushy peas in a can when you reach a certain point.

breasts are going to be included, but i believe that the beginning armours will probably be fleshy because by the time the characters got a decent "level" the novelty of pixel "boooobiiieeessss" will have quite simply worn off. cloth wearing females are most likely to stay feminine and sleek, chosen females are most likely going to be identifiable by breast spacing in the armour, a curved hip and possibly their resting stance.

its all about finding a happy medium, obviously they cant be as "seductive" as a Dark Elf wytch elf but neither are they going to resemlbe an ogre in lipstick.

either way ill probs start a male character, sexist no, but atleast i wont run the risk of somebody mistaking me as a 13yr old pimple with a teenage boy attached : \

if you cant understand my english...well ill be quite surprised...just sound a word out phonetically and u get its "txt" equivalent :) though iv tried not to go 2 over the top with it!

T

[Frein]

I'm hoping they'll look something like the girl to the right in this wallpaper: http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/1199/fsnkings12801024ov4.jpg

Of course the art style has to be matched with the rest of the game and IP but I think that one has a few good ideas:

1. She is clearly beautiful despite being evil (chaotic) and clad in heavy plate.
2. The armor is thick and bulky, which suits the chosen.
3. The armor uses dark colours, mainly black, which is what the chosen will surely look like anyway.
4. Plus she has straight, blonde, almost white hair, which was very common for the Nordic peoples in the past (less common nowadays).

I suppose she needs proper shoulder pads, though. At least male chosen are all about the shoulder pads. :P

[SwaY]

Sorry to burst your bubble mate.... but Chaos Male and Female both wear full Ornate and don't stay 'attractive' as many have mentioned, they may start off scatily clad and somewhat pretty, but before long the 'Chaos' energy will take over and any sort of looks that were there will be long gone!

[Immortalis]

I'm hoping they'll look something like the girl to the right in this wallpaper: http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/1199/fsnkings12801024ov4.jpg

Anime? HERESY!

Anyway, I think that once you hit T4, you won't be able to remove any of your armor. You also will be fully encased in it. So expect to see beefy, muscular women completely clad in Chaos armor running around in T4 zones.

[kharnage]

Have you guys seen the chosen models in the new newsletter?

A lot of chosen but no females. I thought that was a little different.

Based on the skimpy info, maybe they are still really working on them.

[AlltheMyriadWays]

I'm hoping they'll look something like the girl to the right in this wallpaper: http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/1199/fsnkings12801024ov4.jpg

Of course the art style has to be matched with the rest of the game and IP but I think that one has a few good ideas:

1. She is clearly beautiful despite being evil (chaotic) and clad in heavy plate.
2. The armor is thick and bulky, which suits the chosen.
3. The armor uses dark colours, mainly black, which is what the chosen will surely look like anyway.
4. Plus she has straight, blonde, almost white hair, which was very common for the Nordic peoples in the past (less common nowadays).


The delicious irony is that while games have problems with women in chainmail bikinis, a hentai gets it right.

[Arathan]

I'm hoping they'll look something like the girl to the right in this wallpaper: http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/1199/fsnkings12801024ov4.jpg

Of course the art style has to be matched with the rest of the game and IP but I think that one has a few good ideas:

1. She is clearly beautiful despite being evil (chaotic) and clad in heavy plate.
2. The armor is thick and bulky, which suits the chosen.
3. The armor uses dark colours, mainly black, which is what the chosen will surely look like anyway.
4. Plus she has straight, blonde, almost white hair, which was very common for the Nordic peoples in the past (less common nowadays).

I suppose she needs proper shoulder pads, though. At least male chosen are all about the shoulder pads. :P
Sakura and (dark) Saber ^^ brilliant :>
And I definitely agree. Adapted to Warhammer art of course, and heavier/more chaosy, that armour style is really something I'd be happy with.
The delicious irony is that while games have problems with women in chainmail bikinis, a hentai gets it right.
True, Type Moon are amazing at character design really :> Too bad you didn't get to see dark Saber in the anime though... I would have loved to see that animated.

[Desdren]

I don't want a pretty chain mail bikini Chosen.

I want her to be a Chaos Chosen, Black Ornate plate with heretical runes carved into it, Spiked gloves, full plate helm with a pair of red glowing eyes and carrying a giant two headed Axe that spews Chaotic energy with a Mutated appendage or three.

Curves would be Nice and some feminine curves behind the amour would be fine, but when you approach this type of Character on the battlefield you shouldn't even need to look at it to know you had better run.

She is Chaos incarnate and will rip of your man hood and make you eat it.

[ApricotSoup]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v74/apricotsoup/FemaleChosen.jpg

Something fast I did a while ago to try and illustrate what I'd prefer, beefing her up with more with bulkier shoulder pads and stuff would suit me but there really should not be the slightest hint of skin around :3

[Psyche]

I'm hoping it'll be heavily-armour clad females, with the normal curves, slightly more slender bodies, but still compeltely covered. I want full-plate, big spikes, dark armour...the lot. Skimpy armour annoys me in games. Yes, it's aesthetically pleasing, but it isn't realistic, and it just makes me look like a total loser when I'm the only female running around with my entire body covered, and no one wants to roleplay with me because there's a chick standing in the corner with no clothes on. :P

[TheDeinonychus]

I said it before and I'll repeat it here again. I do NOT want some skinny little over-developed teenager running around with barely enough armor to cover up her breasts and arse. I also do NOT want her to look totaly horrific, barely distinguishable from a male character.

What I do want is the happy middle. A girl that looks like she knows how to fight and knows how to kill, that's well armed and armored and muscular enough to look like she means buisness while still looking feminine and atleast on the par side of attractive.

They dont have to look like swimsuit edition models, but they dont have to look like the bottom of the barrel either. Remember, this is Tzeentch we're talking about, not Nurgle. Tzeentch has all sorts of eligant yet dealy aspects, and it should be reflected in the apperance of the characters. Just cause they follow dark and evil gods doesnt mean they cant be attractive, if even in the sense that they'll beat you to within an inch of your life if you dont agree.

[checkthis5000]

I said it before and I'll repeat it here again. I do NOT want some skinny little over-developed teenager running around with barely enough armor to cover up her breasts and arse. I also do NOT want her to look totaly horrific, barely distinguishable from a male character.

What I do want is the happy middle. A girl that looks like she knows how to fight and knows how to kill, that's well armed and armored and muscular enough to look like she means buisness while still looking feminine and atleast on the par side of attractive.

They dont have to look like swimsuit edition models, but they dont have to look like the bottom of the barrel either. Remember, this is Tzeentch we're talking about, not Nurgle. Tzeentch has all sorts of eligant yet dealy aspects, and it should be reflected in the apperance of the characters. Just cause they follow dark and evil gods doesnt mean they cant be attractive, if even in the sense that they'll beat you to within an inch of your life if you dont agree.

I think you wont have to worry about the over-developed teenager stuff. All the females so far look very womanly, and not like teenagers at all.

[Deimos]

When it comes to the skimpy dancer look in chain underwear I say leave that look to the puny elves were it belongs. Give me some good 6"ft dancers of death wearing full plate covered in spikes and the blood of the weak and ill be happy. In my view its all about the armor forget about the flesh that rots away with age and battle, afterall a face thats cut off by an axe is a face that no longer apeals to even an orc.

[Kazek Ironfist]

If you do read Gotrek in Felix, in the second book I believe they encounter a female chosen leading a chaos warband that attacks a city they are in. She ends up getting killed by her daughter... but from the description that gave, she was just as well armored and muscled as a man would be, so in reality telling them apart later in the game really should only be simply because she looks a bit skinner and maybe has hair coming out of the back of the helmet, that sounds like it would work, and maybe have some feminine curves designed into the armor like it's normally done.

[Khaade]

Like this? :rolleyes:

http://www.gagreport.com/Funny_Pictures/Freaky%20People/freaky_muscle_lady.jpg
http://www.gagreport.com/Funny_Pictures/Freaky%20People/muscle_woman.jpg

Or a guy: http://www.gagreport.com/Funny_Pictures/Freaky%20People/muscle_man.jpg

*shutter* thats just disgusting... really...

[Axxar]

Yuck. The more dressed in armour a female Chosen becomes, the more attractive she becomes as we are unable to see her body :)

[Hatemonger]

Yuck. The more dressed in armour a female Chosen becomes, the more attractive she becomes as we are unable to see her body :)

Wait, what?

[Moziah_Rahl]

If you do read Gotrek in Felix, in the second book I believe they encounter a female chosen leading a chaos warband that attacks a city they are in. She ends up getting killed by her daughter... but from the description that gave, she was just as well armored and muscled as a man would be, so in reality telling them apart later in the game really should only be simply because she looks a bit skinner and maybe has hair coming out of the back of the helmet, that sounds like it would work, and maybe have some feminine curves designed into the armor like it's normally done.

The book also states that the armour was part of her figure; being graphed into her skin and figure. So you would see bobs ect.

[Athenys]

Take a look at this vision of chaotic beauty:

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b362/aimelek/femchaosb.jpg

"Here she comes..." to bite the your PC's head off that is. IMO many battle-hardened female chosen would be built like that. She looks like a handsome, big-boned woman who heard the laughter of the dark gods one too many times O_o.


UPDATE: She's got big shoulders now...

[The Penguin Hunter]

I like most, if not all your work, but this one ... heh, I think she needs a more sense of commanding, wider shoulders and what not

[Okri]

It's quite simple if you want a female Chosen, really. Roll a chosen and call it Sue. End of story.

[The Penguin Hunter]

Well I heard Mythic is rethinking it's male only chosen descision

[Athenys]

Thank Chaos for that bit of news :). I thought I was going to have to play nothing but DE...

[ChosenOne]

Take a look at this vision of chaotic beauty:

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b362/aimelek/femchaosb.jpg

"Here she comes..." to bite the your PC's head off that is. IMO many battle-hardened female chosen would be built like that. She looks like a handsome, big-boned woman who heard the laughter of the dark gods one too many times O_o.


UPDATE: She's got big shoulders now...

Seriously, she is just nuts. Someone get her a helm because she is going to scare the kids.

Very nice.

[Biocide]

Thank Chaos for that bit of news :). I thought I was going to have to play nothing but DE...
...
*Whips out the bubble popper*
I hate to break it to you, but there's no links involved in The Penguin Hunter's announcement. No links with official stamps on them means it's pure speculation. I'll also add some: not only will they be female chosen, but you can play as a non-sex Chosen! Because you and I both know you can tell under all that armor! :roll:

Let this die, female chosen would be graphically indistinguishable from male chosen at later tiers in 95% of their overall body structure.

[Athenys]

Oh come on now, one can hope? Female chosen would tend to be smaller than their male counterparts and would also show variation in build. It's not as simple as taking a male model and giving it a 'girly' name :rolleyes:. If we can't have a female model for this class then how about a female Maurader ;)...

[Memnos]

The funny thing about the argument that women would have a different build from men is:

Men have a different build from men. There are tall men and short men, skinny men and fat men. Will we have the opportunity to make someone who doesn't look -exactly- the same build as others? I will quickly become bored if everyone has the same build.

[Biocide]

The funny thing about the argument that women would have a different build from men is:

Men have a different build from men. There are tall men and short men, skinny men and fat men. Will we have the opportunity to make someone who doesn't look -exactly- the same build as others? I will quickly become bored if everyone has the same build.
Agreed, just because there's male only chosen doesn't mean there's only one big, x by y, by z model. And some women, especially ones running around battlefields hefting plate armor and several foot long swords, look quite a bit more muscular than men. It's a person's actions that determine muscle mass and where it's at, not their masculinity.

[Bluucandi]

Mythic is seriously rethinking designing female chosen? I must say I was very baffled when they first announced no female chosen after playing DAoC for so many years. I've seen what Mythic can do with a female form. Anyone posting here who's played female firbolgs and female trolls know's what I'm talking about. They are capable of creating models that are both large, muscular, and female in appearance. It's a simple concept really - you give it an hour glass shape and embelish it with whatever detail you need to give it a class flavor.

[Ralzar]

Mythic is seriously rethinking designing female chosen?

Not that we know of. Unless someone can actually produce a link to prove it.

[Bluucandi]

Well I heard Mythic is rethinking it's male only chosen descision

I'd like to see some evidance backing this quote. Was this in an official newsletter?

[Nocturne]

Chosen in giant plate = no visual sex differences. As aforementioned, hair coming out the back would suffice.

Boobs on giant plated chest isn't practical or realistic. Unless said Chosen female had such enormous boobs that the plate-mail actually had to be molded that way. That would require like a size Z boob size full of muscle.

Females 'boobs' get squished to their torso after putting on protective wool/cotton clothing, putting chain-mail on, THEN putting on the giant suit of plate. The ONLY REASON boobs are ever 'molded' onto plate-mail are for sheer aesthetic quality.

As for the rest of armor, no it doesn't get "molded with more curves" for females. It's armor. it's plate. It works the same way for any humanoid putting it on. Making it "feminine" has no practical value other than appeasing the need for chosen chicks.

If people want female chosen, they can live with the same armor as their male counterparts and tape a pony-tail to their back of their heads if it's really that important.


Female marauders I am all for. Makes total sense, and the near-naked nature of Nordic warriors means they will do just fine as females. They best look as hairy and ugly as the males tho'. Otherwise they are not very maruadery are they.

[Zzulu]

They do have plated females in the empire in WAR. Both the female warrior priest and the female knight of the blazing sun are wearing heavy armor in the concept art, and it looks good.

All mythic would have to do is adapt that for chaos, and we're good to go.

http://mythicmktg.fileburst.com/war/us/media/images/careers/WarriorPriest02_06.jpg
http://mythicmktg.fileburst.com/war/us/media/images/careers/KOBS_05.jpg
http://mythicmktg.fileburst.com/war/us/media/images/careers/KOBS_11.jpg

[Bluucandi]

Chosen in giant plate = no visual sex differences. As aforementioned, hair coming out the back would suffice.

Boobs on giant plated chest isn't practical or realistic. Unless said Chosen female had such enormous boobs that the plate-mail actually had to be molded that way. That would require like a size Z boob size full of muscle.

Females 'boobs' get squished to their torso after putting on protective wool/cotton clothing, putting chain-mail on, THEN putting on the giant suit of plate. The ONLY REASON boobs are ever 'molded' onto plate-mail are for sheer aesthetic quality.

As for the rest of armor, no it doesn't get "molded with more curves" for females. It's armor. it's plate. It works the same way for any humanoid putting it on. Making it "feminine" has no practical value other than appeasing the need for chosen chicks.

If people want female chosen, they can live with the same armor as their male counterparts and tape a pony-tail to their back of their heads if it's really that important.


Female marauders I am all for. Makes total sense, and the near-naked nature of Nordic warriors means they will do just fine as females. They best look as hairy and ugly as the males tho'. Otherwise they are not very maruadery are they.

I get the feeling you haven't played an MMO with female tanks. DAoC and WoW both have classes that wear plate armor and are female. For example: paladins and warriors. No major design problems, no one had gripes about them either.

Yes, the boobs are indeed accented within the chest piece and no they were not always enormous. No cleavage is shown (in DAoC) but you can see definite curvature. If you need sceenies I'm sure I could dig around and link them for you.

Females in armor (chain, plate, leather, reinforced) are very common in DAoC. Mythic did a fantastic job of making the models feminine without making the armor slutty. So... I just don't get the failure of some people to accept this reality.

[Estebar]

Boobs on giant plated chest isn't practical or realistic. Since when is Chaos ever practical or realistic?

[Bluucandi]

Since when is Chaos ever practical or realistic?

Right!

Let's think about what was said: half naked female maruaders are "ok" but full armored female chosen are not? You arguement is not really about practicalities and realism. It's about sex appeal. :p

[Orghammer]

Just one thing...who cares? Its just one class out of 24. And correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't which elves female only? I'm a male, and I could care less if half the classes were female only! Playing either gender really makes no difference to me.

[Bluucandi]

Just one thing...who cares? Its just one class out of 24. And correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't which elves female only? I'm a male, and I could care less if half the classes were female only! Playing either gender really makes no difference to me.

Who cares? The female gaming population that is interested in playing melee classes on the Destruction side for starters. We do get to roll female Black Guards and WE, yes. But that is what we are limited to. I know this is an old arguement but early on someone said that Mythic was "rethinking" their decision and a little spark of hope flared up.

[Tarantio]

Not wanting to fan the flames here or anything, but as far as i remember having read Gotrek and Felix, the one Chosen Female ever to have existed in lore never actually became a fully fledged Chosen. She was merely a trainee. And she failed.


Just saying... :P

[checkthis5000]

Not wanting to fan the flames here or anything, but as far as i remember having read Gotrek and Felix, the one Chosen Female ever to have existed in lore never actually became a fully fledged Chosen. She was merely a trainee. And she failed.


Just saying... :P

These flames have been burning since the world's been turning. And we didn't start it. So fan away.

Well they've been burning since March anyway, or at least that's what the first post says.

[Bluucandi]

Not wanting to fan the flames here or anything, but as far as i remember having read Gotrek and Felix, the one Chosen Female ever to have existed in lore never actually became a fully fledged Chosen. She was merely a trainee. And she failed.


Just saying... :P

Ahhh... the old, stale lore argument. Well, you're going to try and convince someone who's playing a Disciple - a class the contricts itself lorewise as the followers of the God of Murder. Thus, you're flames fail to effect me. 8)

[Zzulu]

As long as there's nothing in the lore that directly states that there can be no female chosen, I'd gladly see them around

same with marauders.

[Orghammer]

Who cares? The female gaming population that is interested in playing melee classes on the Destruction side for starters. We do get to roll female Black Guards and WE, yes. But that is what we are limited to. I know this is an old arguement but early on someone said that Mythic was "rethinking" their decision and a little spark of hope flared up.


All I'm saying is that I can't see the big deal. Although with this kind of backlash from the issue, I would not be surprised if Mythic did change their minds.

[Ralzar]

As long as there's nothing in the lore that directly states that there can be no female chosen, I'd gladly see them around

There's actually some examples that directly state that chosen CAN be female.

The book Trollslayer is one example, also there's a few descriptions in Warhammer rule books that describes chaos warriors as "men and women".
There's probably a few others that I'm forgetting, but that's probably allready more lore than you'll find about female witch hunters, warrior priests, knights of the blazing sun, bright wizards or dwarfs.

[MrDreadful]

A lot of characters in Warhammer Fantasy Battles-related stuff are male just because they know a lot of men are into the hobby and they want them picturing themselves looking as badass generals. Female Chaos cultists of all types are possible and completely cannon. The only time I wouldn't want to see female characters is with Skaven or Greenskins. Otherwise, equal representation for equal slayage!

[ChosenOne]

I wish they would just give us female chosen and marauders so that we wont have to continue having threads about this continually.

Thats not a flame on you guys discussing it. Its just this has been discussed SO many times.

[Biocide]

I feel that the current stance of a chosen is just fine. I have no issues not being able to play a female chosen, as I would consider it compared to a male (I generally pick male simply because I don't get rather random tells for... well, best left unsaid really).
I personally don't see why they didn't add a female chosen in the first place. Other than not having to develop the character models, I can't see why this choice was made. Anyone have any ideas?

[Tyurion]

i like how our threads descend into helpless bickering

[MrDreadful]

i like how our threads descend into helpless bickering

I disagree!

[khaze]

They'll be big walking, spikey, metal hulks.

With boobs.

nuff said. lmao

[Tarantio]

There really is nothing at all stopping you from calling your Chosen Doris, and letting everyone know that she is interested in drapes and cooking you know. Under all that armour she could be anything, its not like her breasts would show under that much metal.

[Damienx247]

I can't see why Mythic couldn't "borrow" the basic design of a 40K Sister of Battle, and make it both archaic and Tzeentch -themed.

[Boulvae]

Cause thats sci-fi themed armour, Warhammer mid-evil themed and sci-fi themed just doesn't really work that well when you actually put both together, ESPECIALLY for when the Chosen in WAR are described as hulking behemoths which means that the Sisters of Battle's armour would not work because it's not hulking, huge, and bulky for an iconic look which is WHY Mythic CAN'T do them justice.

Not to mention that if they were put together 40k would overshadow the world of fantasy look to it.

[Damienx247]

Cause thats sci-fi themed armour, Warhammer mid-evil themed and sci-fi themed just doesn't really work that well when you actually put both together, ESPECIALLY for when the Chosen in WAR are described as hulking behemoths which means that the Sisters of Battle's armour would not work because it's not hulking, huge, and bulky for an iconic look which is WHY Mythic CAN'T do them justice.

Not to mention that if they were put together 40k would overshadow the world of fantasy look to it.

So you're telling me some skilled concept artist could not take a sci-fi desgn for the base of armor design and make it look medieval/ ancient/ magical etc? Its very simple, remove the power pack, the bolter, any bionics or high tech crap. Add some eye and bird motifs, paint it blue, replace the fleur-de-lys style helmet with a slightly smaller Chosen helmet and you got a female chosen.

[Damienx247]

Man...using a bed as a drawing surface sucks. Gotta get my drawing table out of the garage. Anyway this will be my last entry into this thread, win or lose. Rather than wasting more words on this subject, I'm just gonna leave a link to a quick and dirty sketch of a female chosen I finished drawing a few minutes ago. http://damienx247.deviantart.com/art/Female-Chosen-sketch-74110233

[Nocturne]

Man...using a bed as a drawing surface sucks. Gotta get my drawing table out of the garage. Anyway this will be my last entry into this thread, win or lose. Rather than wasting more words on this subject, I'm just gonna leave a link to a quick and dirty sketch of a female chosen I finished drawing a few minutes ago. http://damienx247.deviantart.com/art/Female-Chosen-sketch-74110233

There's the crux of the problem. The shapely armor, the thin pelvic region, the booby armor.

That's not a Chaos chosen.

Chaos Chosen = giant bulking metal armor. As many others have already addressed, the only visual difference between a male chosen and female should only be the hair-styles. Otherwise it looks to flimsy and small for what the Chosen represents.

If there are to be female chosen they need to be the same stature as their male counterparts. Which is ok by me, but teenies are all about curves and tinyness for "Female Tanks". Leave it in WoW please.

They didn't become Chosen by being a super-model; they earned it by years of savage fighting in the trenches. That requires muscle, and lots of it.

[Reaver]

They're not making them because they won't be right.

The vision of a Chaos Chosen is a gigantic brutal and heavily armoured giant. Why are you still looking for that to become a woman and therefore be forced to adhere to curves when it looks just perfect as it is?

I just can't understand the need for it and that sketch is not a Chosen, its something out of Dragonlance.

[Misanthrope Prime]

Take a look at this vision of chaotic beauty:

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b362/aimelek/femchaosb.jpg

"Here she comes..." to bite the your PC's head off that is. IMO many battle-hardened female chosen would be built like that. She looks like a handsome, big-boned woman who heard the laughter of the dark gods one too many times O_o.


UPDATE: She's got big shoulders now...


FapFapFapFapFapFapFapFapFapFapFapFapFapFapFapFapFa pFapFapFapFapFap.

[The Penguin Hunter]

Take a look at this vision of chaotic beauty:

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b362/aimelek/femchaosb.jpg

"Here she comes..." to bite the your PC's head off that is. IMO many battle-hardened female chosen would be built like that. She looks like a handsome, big-boned woman who heard the laughter of the dark gods one too many times O_o.


UPDATE: She's got big shoulders now...

Now if I saw that on the battle field I might actualy consider running... that or not getting close to it, where's a bright wizard when you need em?

[WNxKenwayy]

Every picture thus far for a 'female' Chosen just ends up looking like a female Dark Elf in heavy armor =\

[Misanthrope Prime]

Every picture thus far for a 'female' Chosen just ends up looking like a female Dark Elf in heavy armor =\

Well, to be honest, I don't see any art of muscular females that isn't fetish-related.



Actually, come to think of it, I bet a lot of FBB fans and macrophiles'd end up rolling a female chosen if they're in, kind of like how I knew a lot of furry tauren and druids.

[The Penguin Hunter]

Well, to be honest, I don't see any art of muscular females that isn't fetish-related.



Actually, come to think of it, I bet a lot of FBB fans and macrophiles'd end up rolling a female chosen if they're in, kind of like how I knew a lot of furry tauren and druids.


That's kind of sick now that I think about it ... oh well let them enjoy what they want, just as long as it fits lore ...

[Misanthrope Prime]

That's kind of sick now that I think about it ... oh well let them enjoy what they want, just as long as it fits lore ...



To each their own. Though to be honest, imagine what Slaanesh would do if he got a hold on someone like that.

[Tea TIme With Death]

the females and pro female chosen that look girlish are contradicting themselves. they wont play orcs because they are "ugly" and "masculine" YET if mythic puts female chosen in the game (and are smart about it) then the chosen will and SHOULD be BIG AND BURLY and built for BATTLE and carnage. There should not be huge curves on plate as in WoW where all chestplates were retarded looking and fit you like a spandex shirt. Your FEMALE chosen will be ugly, they will be BIG and they will be built for war. Only time you SHould be able to see the boobs is at lvl 1-5 where u got crap leather/cloth armor.

and these are the reasons you wont play orcs, because of how they look.

it is ignorant to not play a class because of gender. i bet MAX two logical and repspectable females per server will play an orc/goblin and thats sad.

you want your curves? play a WE. i want my dwarfs to be more muscular and less round. and its not stoppin me. and if i want to play a WE, the fact that its female only has 0% infliction upon my interests in a class. I go by what is fun and what suits my playstyle. and everything currently in game looks fine to me. those of you who think things look "ugly" deal its not gonna change.

[The Penguin Hunter]

Well actualy the armor should actualy in a sense look like skin since it's the armor is fused with the skin, and what's underneath is basicaly not considered human any more,

But yeah big.. and Chosen ish

[Tea TIme With Death]

OH and wheres the link where mythic stated they were rethinking female chosen? OP says it as if its fact. PROOF please.

[Tea TIme With Death]

you become a chosen by beating other chaos champions until your god sees fit to make you one. Now where does a lithe skinny small boob infested body come into play when you are facing off 1v1 against an 8 foot tall norscan barbarian in glowing bleeding screaming armor? and an axe that glows black with malice?

chosen are about BRUTAL POWER AND STRENGTH not speed for those who would counter "but she would be faster and avoid his attacks!" Even if she did, that wouldnt last forever and eventually would be beat. probably very soon.

[Astro]

EDIT: Where'd that come from? Keep the random political jabs off the forum please.

[The Penguin Hunter]

Actualy Tea Time, you're really taking what I said the wrong way, and yes I agree with you i'd like to see the link also Tea, i'm assuming you're talking to me..


Lets go with lore, first off there's cites of female chosen in lore, Norse women are appearantly very cpaable and we all know the Chaos gods don't look at gender.

Now for the CHosen, yes while they are the chosen of their god they are no longer human, thus why they look so bulkey, their gods changed em adn what not, so yes I aslo agree the female chosen wouldn't thin she'd be rather big actualy and techincaly she as to be because of the "what you see is what you get rule" that Mythic is using

But still lore wise the armor is basicaly grafted to the skin so ... it is kind of form fitting, however I doubt that the female chosen has any "form" left after becomming a chosen anyway.

[Tea TIme With Death]

it wasnt directed at you but at people who want boobplates. or Femalish looking chosen. because if they werent female looking they wouldnt want them. which pisses me off because if a female were chosen adn gained the ranks of her god and was mutated with bulk adn strength she wouldnt look female.

[The Penguin Hunter]

Ok good, sorry I had no clue who you were directing you posts, at so I just assumed that I was mis understood and you were directing them at me so .. sorry :)

[Misanthrope Prime]

We could have ornate eyes on the chest where boobs would BE, but they would not actually be bazonkas.

[WNxKenwayy]

Take 2 seconds to look at any warhammer lore with chaos champions (that's what Chosen are) and tell me what size her breast would have to be to even come close to needing 'curves' in the breast plate.

Face it, female champions exist in Lore, but make no sense in WAR because of the design of the Chosen class.

Why the hell do people get so worked up over this stuff. And why does the chosen have to be male? Whose to say it isn't like an orc, no sexuality, just 'it'. Sense they can't take their armor off they can't procreate/strip/etc so no way to tell.

[Astro]

Take 2 seconds to look at any warhammer lore with chaos champions (that's what Chosen are) and tell me what size her breast would have to be to even come close to needing 'curves' in the breast plate.

Face it, female champions exist in Lore, but make no sense in WAR because of the design of the Chosen class.

Why the hell do people get so worked up over this stuff. And why does the chosen have to be male? Whose to say it isn't like an orc, no sexuality, just 'it'. Sense they can't take their armor off they can't procreate/strip/etc so no way to tell.

I was thinking the exact same thing, well said.

[Boulvae]

But the Chosen in WAR are on their way to becomeing a champion, their not a champion yet just in the middle of warrior and champion.

[Zzulu]

they can take their armor off, as seen in the screenshots

[Boulvae]

They can only take their helmet off until their body ups and dies. Then they can't even take off the helmet anymore.

[WNxKenwayy]

they can take their armor off, as seen in the screenshots

oh? Linkie?

The most powerful and favored warriors among these human worshippers of Chaos are called Champions, and are exceptionally powerful in battle. Among them, strength is authority, and so these Champions are also the leaders among their people. Such creatures are so potent and so mutated they can scarcely be called human any longer. They tend to wield massive weapons that a normal man would struggle to lift, and are clad in Chaos Armor that is bound to their skin. These Champions of Chaos are among the most powerful and terrifying adversaries in all the world

Straight from the Warhammer website. Chosen = Champions, which fits the lore perfectly. They are clad in armor bound to their skin (sans helmet of course possible as seen in many many pictures if that's what you meant.

They are referred to as 'creatures' not men, or guys, or anything like that. Chosen = sexless. So get over this topic and let Mythic worry about something actually important.

[Zzulu]

Just google champion of tzeentch and you'll find numerous creatures that are much slimmer than the bulky mass of chaos armor that is WAR's chosen. Apparently Tzeentch can accept all kinds of spindly horrible creatures wielding terrible strength and weaponry in his army.

Oh, but not women, right?

Also, I have gotten over it, but then guys come in here and say things like they're "sexless". They're not sexless in WAR. They're men. As evidenced by in game screenshots.

Now let this discussion die. It is being discussed in at least 3 other current threads. In the end it is up to Mythic and there's not much we can do about it.

[Nocturne]

Just google champion of tzeentch and you'll find numerous creatures that are much slimmer than the bulky mass of chaos armor that is WAR's chosen. Apparently Tzeentch can accept all kinds of spindly horrible creatures wielding terrible strength and weaponry in his army.

Oh, but not women, right?

Also, I have gotten over it, but then guys come in here and say things like they're "sexless". They're not sexless in WAR. They're men. As evidenced by in game screenshots.

Now let this discussion die. It is being discussed in at least 3 other current threads. In the end it is up to Mythic and there's not much we can do about it.


Your not grasping the concept. IF and "IF" there are to be Chosen 'women' they need to be as beefy as the male chosen. I think people can ACCEPT it, if the female chosen are just as butch and manly as well, the men. What I don't want to see is useless boob armor and slim fitting plate-mail. I believe that is what "we" fear about this the most.

Nobody is arguing or even caring about how many things or people run around with chaos spiky bits. Totally un-related. The Chosen class needs to have uniformity, not what strange crap Tzeentch can throw on his warrior-followers.

[Zzulu]

I showed the concept art of the slimmer champions to prove a point; namely that their strength comes from magic and dark gifts and not from the fibres in their muscles.

But even so, I don't think you should slim them down at all, because I think you could do a female chosen justice after having seen female warriors in 40K, but I seem to be in the minority on that one.

I'm just disgruntled about this whole thing, because I planned on playing a heavily armored chaos female. Which wont happen now.

[Boulvae]

I'd also like to mention that the sisters of battle arn't even capable of wearing the whole suits of armour that space marines are donned (they basically use the same equipment), because of the fact that the space marines are MUCH bigger then any average human (lore-wise) so using the sisters of battle is still not good enough because thats not the full equipment space marines wear, and the stuff they can wear is heavily adjusted to suit them or going around it instead.

You may make that as a point that proves your side but it's not, thats not hulking armour and they arn't hulking. They are average non-hulking, non 8 feet humans trying to wear suits and use equipment (that has to be adjusted and tweeked) that hulking genetically manipulated hulks can use perfectly fine.

[Zzulu]

I think it is perfectly sufficient for a chaos warrior female looking like that, representing her god of change. Obviously this is here we differ in opinion.

[Psiho246]

They'll be big walking, spikey, metal hulks.

With boobs.

boobs, weeeeeeeee
lol kidding

well in the chaos world of mutation, i doubt there is any room for pretty lol!

[Athenys]

Every picture thus far for a 'female' Chosen just ends up looking like a female Dark Elf in heavy armor =\

With evil=spiky you are going to have some aesthetic overlapping, but there are more differences than not : http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b362/aimelek/CHVSDE.jpg
IMO the female Chosen still looks like she could eat that higher tier DoK for breakfast...with sauce :p!

[Boulvae]

With evil=spiky you are going to have some aesthetic overlapping, but there are more differences than not : http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b362/aimelek/CHVSDE.jpg
IMO the female Chosen still looks like she could eat that higher tier DoK for breakfast...with sauce :p!

Wheres the blue? Wheres the bird features that are supposed to be prominant? Why isn't she hulking? Why is it MORE chainmailish, when Daemon armour is plate and the chainmail is just meant to cover areas not given said plates? Whats with the vampire look? WHERES THE FREAKING HELMET?!

I forgot which god has the fish traits...

EDIT: Her chin seems to have a bit of Nurgle on it, which means that she be not a Tzeentchian (unless thats coagulated blood).

Why doesn't it got the iconic feel it's supposed to have to prove that they can be given justice?

[Flegler]

Wheres the blue? Wheres the bird features that are supposed to be prominant? Why isn't she hulking? Why is it MORE chainmailish, when Daemon armour is plate and the chainmail is just meant to cover areas not given said plates? Whats with the vampire look? WHERES THE FREAKING HELMET?!

This is all entirely irrelevant. It's a picture of woman in heavy armour and it proves that women can wear heavy armour and still look suitably intimidating. The ornaments can be added later.

[Athenys]

Exactly. It's a generic concept piece meant to show that female followers of chaos don't need to be 'pretty' to be included in more PC classes. If we were to bulk her up and add iconic Tzeentchian elements to her armor then she would fit the part of the crazed warrior perfectly. As to why she is pale, she's from up north ya know ;)...

[Godric]

I think that female chosen are scarier than male chosen. Not only do females have a larger emotional range than males, but they also have certain times of the month that make them...angry.

[Boulvae]

They don't have more of an emotional range, they ussually just understand them better. Once a female warriar/chosen/champion's body turns to dust it nolonger mattters.

AND that heavy armour may count, but it's not FULL PLATE, it'd be more scale mail or chainmail. The northman that are up north arn't as pale as her (i'd say she be albino), she'd fit the bill for a slaaneshi and she's still pretty not generic.

EDIT: AND i'm not arguing generic female in full plate, but heres the thing i've gotten one real female to wear full plate on halloween, wanna know the vissual difference? Height, either then that she coudld've been mistaken for a man if not for her voice.

NOW I'M arguing the iconicness, and general feel Chosen of WAR specifically, not generic females in general. May seem that way but i'm arguing against using regular females, which you seem to not be giving me or anyone else regular female examples, all you've been giving are stereotypical "feminine" featured heavy armour with some pretty faces on it excluding the sister of battle.

Skinny, and curvy heavy armour doesn't mean feminine all the time unless stereotyped, the Chosen's look for WAR is supposed to be iconic and hulking monsters. The females would obviously ALSO be hulking monsters with muscle,which is why they can't be done because they'd CAN'T be done justic prurely because the Chosen are FULLY body covered and their armour which is also overly large and imposing - not your typical heavy armour.

Seriously for a good example take a look at the lowest tier chosen's head size is in comparison to the armour, something nothing at all like the heavy armour examples you've given.

[LordLaggen]

tbh i dont think it matters if they have female Chosen.. they will just look smaller but still a walking hunk of metal...

While using Chaos armor it becomes as a second skin... So u wont have any bekini raids with Chosen chosen females

[FoulPet]

No reason not to have a set of armor similiar to the left one (Of couse in WH style). I would rather not see something like the one on the right. (Yes I know where its from) Giving Armor some slight curves should be pretty easy for just about anyone with the skill to create an entire model. Textures should change little to not at all and animations/skeletons shouldn't be effected.

http://img231.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1175038023fullresje5.jpg

[Boulvae]

Theres a very noticable difference EXCEPT, the female one has the whole flesh exposed vs. non-exposed flesh thing going on. The chainmail didn't have to be tossed, and obviously the female is missing the mask covering for the bottom, which seems like an impeding change.

But you make a good point, but it still has one problem, they'd still look exactly the same regardless (if chainmail was still on and the like).

[FoulPet]

Theres a very noticable difference EXCEPT, the female one has the whole flesh exposed vs. non-exposed flesh thing going on. The chainmail didn't have to be tossed, and obviously the female is missing the mask covering for the bottom, which seems like an impeding change.

But you make a good point, but it still has one problem, they'd still look exactly the same regardless (if chainmail was still on and the like).

Yes they would be "almost exactly" :?: the same. The point is that with very little effort they could add 2 slightly raised bumps decreases model size by 1/10 and call it a female and make everyone happy. ( I use the term "everyone" lightly)

I DO NOT want to see chaos women looking like WoW elves but Having the option of an amazon chaos warrior in full chaos plate is kinda nice.

[Estebar]

I still think Father Jack did the best depiction of a female chosen in his strip Impossible Chaos (http://www.secretlivesofmobs.com/index.php?strip_id=21) (final panel).

She big, she's bulky, but she's got boobs and a waist.

Chaos Armour clings to you, and re-shapes itself around your extremities. It adapts to mutations and emphasises them! OF COURSE its going to accommodate and emphasise breasts!

Some of the Tzeentch designs are also perfect for breastplates! There's this (http://www.thedaemoniclegion.com/Tzeentch.jpg) one, and this (http://home2.inet.tele.dk/json/pics/tzeentch.gif) one, and this (http://www.dev1ance.net/forum/image.php?u=15&dateline=1139954245) one, and this (http://wh40k.ei8ht.net/skins/hangar-8/chaos/thumbs/thousand_sons_tzeentch_bann.jpg) one and, of course, THIS (http://media6.curse-gaming.com/media/resized_images/625x500/18656.jpg) one and THIS (http://www.war-resource.com/images/screenshots/0703_0307_SS_006.jpg) one!

In fact, any of the Disc of Tzeentch designs would work as a female breast plate on a smaller and simpler scale.

[Heresy]

Take a look at this vision of chaotic beauty:

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b362/aimelek/femchaosb.jpg

"Here she comes..." to bite the your PC's head off that is. IMO many battle-hardened female chosen would be built like that. She looks like a handsome, big-boned woman who heard the laughter of the dark gods one too many times O_o.

Sacred phallus, Batman!
To me that looks a lot better than any piece of Chosen artwork Mythic has produced so far, jawsome!

[Tea TIme With Death]

I showed the concept art of the slimmer champions to prove a point; namely that their strength comes from magic and dark gifts and not from the fibres in their muscles.

But even so, I don't think you should slim them down at all, because I think you could do a female chosen justice after having seen female warriors in 40K, but I seem to be in the minority on that one.

I'm just disgruntled about this whole thing, because I planned on playing a heavily armored chaos female. Which wont happen now.


if u dont want to play career you think will be fun just because its male only. shame on you. If white lions were female only i wouldnt care.

IF they made female chosen they would be hulking beasts which is not what you want. you want a female looking chosen which should NOT happen because thats not what they look like.

It is essentially the reason why there will be near no females playing as orcs. cause they are "ugly" and if u get a female chosen it will look worse, and you wont even play it. You just want to be catered to and have a gritty universe changed so u can be happy.

[Zzulu]

if u dont want to play career you think will be fun just because its male only. shame on you. If white lions were female only i wouldnt care.

IF they made female chosen they would be hulking beasts which is not what you want. you want a female looking chosen which should NOT happen because thats not what they look like.


It is essentially the reason why there will be near no females playing as orcs. cause they are "ugly" and if u get a female chosen it will look worse, and you wont even play it. You just want to be catered to and have a gritty universe changed so u can be happy.

As stated in the thread a million times, there are plenty of concept art that would fit a female chosen without making her absolutely hideous and still retaining the behemoth chaos flavour of a chosen. Even so, tzeentch champions are not always huge and they certainly don't always look like gorillas on steroids, so it's not a stretch at all to make a female with some curves, and then adorn her with heavy chaos armor. It's been proven over and over in these threads, and I'm tired of discussing it.

The reason why we don't have female orcs is because orcs don't have a gender. The male-looking orcs are also hideously ugly mind you, so even if they had a gender your argument falls flat.

I don't want the gritty universe to be changed. Where the hell did that came from? Since when would a warrior female make anything less gritty? Do you even know what you're talking about? There are plenty of warrior women in Warhammer :-x

[WNxKenwayy]

As stated in the thread a million times, there are plenty of concept art that would fit a female chosen without making her absolutely hideous and still retaining the behemoth chaos flavour of a chosen. Even so, tzeentch champions are not always huge and they certainly don't always look like gorillas on steroids, so it's not a stretch at all to make a female with some curves, and then adorn her with heavy chaos armor. It's been proven over and over in these threads, and I'm tired of discussing it.

The reason why we don't have female orcs is because orcs don't have a gender. The male-looking orcs are also hideously ugly mind you, so even if they had a gender your argument falls flat.

I don't want the gritty universe to be changed. Where the hell did that came from? Since when would a warrior female make anything less gritty? Do you even know what you're talking about? There are plenty of warrior women in Warhammer :-x

Stop talking about this concept art and post it. Every single one I've seen so far is either far outside the hulking tank look of a Chosen or is just a Dark Elf in heavy armor.

[Taurth]

I don't see why they couldn't just do more or less what they did with the female (http://mythicmktg.fileburst.com/war/us/media/images/screenshots/ss_june8_04.jpg) and male (http://mythicmktg.fileburst.com/war/us/media/images/screenshots/ss_june8_05.jpg) Warrior Priest armour, still keeping it very bulky.

[Tea TIme With Death]

Pretty sure mythic stated they want chosen to be the hulking behemoths they are and SHOULD be. and thats why they are not having female chosen. GW certified it so i dont see the problem. GW feels its OK and they made the lore.

http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/media/wallpaper/full/WAR_wl_0507_01.jpg THAT IS A CHOSEN.

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b362/aimelek/femchaosb.jpg is a urakai with hair tapped on in plate armor.

[Revlid]

Stop talking about this concept art and post it. Every single one I've seen so far is either far outside the hulking tank look of a Chosen or is just a Dark Elf in heavy armor.

http://www.secretlivesofmobs.com/index.php?strip_id=21

Enjoy.

[Tea TIme With Death]

http://www.secretlivesofmobs.com/index.php?strip_id=21

Enjoy.


Only thing that makes her bulky are the giant shoulderpads, everythign else is curves.

u could throw huge shoulder armor on a goblin and make him look mean.

[Zzulu]

Only thing that makes her bulky are the giant shoulderpads, everythign else is curves.

u could throw huge shoulder armor on a goblin and make him look mean.

I'm starting to wonder if the guys opposing a female chosen all are just grasping at straws here. Look at the chosen guy in the intro. He's NOT more bulky than any of the women we've shown, in fact, he's hardly more bulky than the warrior priest he's fighting. He's taller though, I guess.

Or look at this gentleman here, it's just a guy in armor. The shoulderpads are what are making them look broad and overproportioned. Are you telling me that a female version of this is impossible? Totally outrageous? Come on. http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/gameInfo/armiesofWAR/Chaos/Careers/images/Chosen_feature02.jpg

There's room for female chosen in the game, it's just a stylistic principle you opposers can't get past.;)

[Tyurion]

Im fine with it so long as they dont go down the road of plate bikines which apparantly stop bullets. Just have sensible amounts of armour and outdents where her feminine bits are.
Dont you opposer me.




Big grin!:D

[Tyurion]

Theres a very noticable difference EXCEPT, the female one has the whole flesh exposed vs. non-exposed flesh thing going on. The chainmail didn't have to be tossed, and obviously the female is missing the mask covering for the bottom, which seems like an impeding change.

But you make a good point, but it still has one problem, they'd still look exactly the same regardless (if chainmail was still on and the like).
Listen foolish person they both have breasts! Look again!

[Tyurion]

I showed the concept art of the slimmer champions to prove a point; namely that their strength comes from magic and dark gifts and not from the fibres in their muscles.

But even so, I don't think you should slim them down at all, because I think you could do a female chosen justice after having seen female warriors in 40K, but I seem to be in the minority on that one.

I'm just disgruntled about this whole thing, because I planned on playing a heavily armored chaos female. Which wont happen now.
Minority? Pah! Madam I am insulted!

No big grin for you. :mad:



I forgot which god has the fish traits...



tzeentch again... Games workshop wanted to change it to a serpent but it still looks like a fish


chosen are about BRUTAL POWER AND STRENGTH not speed for those who would counter "but she would be faster and avoid his attacks!" Even if she did, that wouldnt last forever and eventually would be beat. probably very soon.
Yep. For all those who DO say 'see would be faster and avoid until he gets tired' Chosen dont get tired. They never get tired. They dont sleep, dont need hardly any food or water and only need chaos to sustain themselves.

I really need to stop posting now...





Big grin!:D

[Tea TIme With Death]

talking about before they are chosen, before they are blessed they have to defeat other warleaders.

[Tyurion]

quote what you are talking about please.

[WNxKenwayy]

I'm starting to wonder if the guys opposing a female chosen all are just grasping at straws here. Look at the chosen guy in the intro. He's NOT more bulky than any of the women we've shown, in fact, he's hardly more bulky than the warrior priest he's fighting. He's taller though, I guess.

Or look at this gentleman here, it's just a guy in armor. The shoulderpads are what are making them look broad and overproportioned. Are you telling me that a female version of this is impossible? Totally outrageous? Come on. http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/gameInfo/armiesofWAR/Chaos/Careers/images/Chosen_feature02.jpg

There's room for female chosen in the game, it's just a stylistic principle you opposers can't get past.;)

The people that want female chosen are grasping at straws. We are following common sense. Common sense says that someone whose 8 feet tall and wearing the heaviest of heavy armor 24/7 isn't going to have hips and breast. Someone that's described as a hulking, massive, tank, etc isn't going to look 'sexy'.

Is a female version impossible? No, of course not. You can make a female Orc if you want too. That doesn't make it right or fit into the concepts Mythic is going for in regards to Chosen. The only reason people aren't complaining about not having a Orc female class is because there is no way to make it look 'sexy'. If for some reason the lore had high elves male only you would be making the same arguments just because you know you can make females look good in elvish armor. Face the facts, the only way to make a female Chosen would have her 'body' look exactly the same as a guys anyways, only the face is different, which means ugly as sin, which you don't want because it doesn't fit into YOUR idea of a female. Same reason why no one would argue for females if the main chaos class was Nurgle, because then they'd be all fat and bloated and ugly.

Are we watching the same intro? Because in the intro the Chaos champion is waaaay bigger than the priest. And not just height, but width and depth. Look when he brings his knee up into his side.

And you still haven't posted links to any decent female chaos champions. The best one so far is from a comic and that is just because the shoulder pads are completely disproportional to the rest of her body which is, again, simply a Dark Elf in heavy armor.

[Taurth]

The people that want female chosen are grasping at straws. We are following common sense. Common sense says that someone whose 8 feet tall and wearing the heaviest of heavy armor 24/7 isn't going to have hips and breast. Someone that's described as a hulking, massive, tank, etc isn't going to look 'sexy'. Personally I don't care whether the famale Chosen is a hulking behemoth or incredible lithe. However its perfectly reasonable lore wise for her to be thin, it just wouldn't be fitting with WAR's represtentation of the the Chosen. In other sources besides WAR, you'd probably find most Champions or Chosen of Tzeentch to be lithe and more graceful rather than a huge hulking behemoth, but thats the way Mythic has chosen to represent them so it would be odd if the female Chosen didn't follow suit.

Is a female version impossible? No, of course not. You can make a female Orc if you want too. That doesn't make it right or fit into the concepts Mythic is going for in regards to Chosen. The only reason people aren't complaining about not having a Orc female class is because there is no way to make it look 'sexy'. If for some reason the lore had high elves male only you would be making the same arguments just because you know you can make females look good in elvish armor. Face the facts, the only way to make a female Chosen would have her 'body' look exactly the same as a guys anyways, only the face is different, which means ugly as sin, which you don't want because it doesn't fit into YOUR idea of a female. Same reason why no one would argue for females if the main chaos class was Nurgle, because then they'd be all fat and bloated and ugly.Thats completely untrue, people don't argue for female Orcs because its completely against the lore. The lore is personally the reason why I'm arguing for female Chosen and Marauders, as its doing the lore an injustice by including female Dwarfs, Warrior Priests, Witch Hunters and Sorcerers and not including a them, which lore wise you'd more likely to see than any of the others I mentioned.

[Derzhus]

I blame the entire factual argument for Female Chosen on a single chapter from Trollslayer, because other than that I have never heard of a Female CHOSEN. That said, I personally have nothing against female Chosen and feel that they could be worked in thematically (but then a gain I wouldn't be playing a female chosen even if they are available),

[Boulvae]

Listen foolish person they both have breasts! Look again!

Look closer, you'll see that the one on the right's chestplate is infact shaped to "acomodate" her breasts, ASWELL as the quite noticable adjusted body, width between the two thus the one on the left is male but I DO see how you could mistake him for a girl because of the breast plate but you see you gotta be REALLY look over the details, of couse I don't see how the one on the right can't wear the same armour seeing as how it'd fit and quite possibly be a little more flexible considering - and protecting considering.

I do agree father jack's is close, but it's no cigar because of one big facter, it's the waist, I mean really thats not exactly what i'd call iconic plate. Plus the arms need to be larger in width to the head.

[Zzulu]

The people that want female chosen are grasping at straws. We are following common sense. Common sense says that someone whose 8 feet tall and wearing the heaviest of heavy armor 24/7 isn't going to have hips and breast. Someone that's described as a hulking, massive, tank, etc isn't going to look 'sexy'.

Is a female version impossible? No, of course not. You can make a female Orc if you want too. That doesn't make it right or fit into the concepts Mythic is going for in regards to Chosen. The only reason people aren't complaining about not having a Orc female class is because there is no way to make it look 'sexy'. If for some reason the lore had high elves male only you would be making the same arguments just because you know you can make females look good in elvish armor. Face the facts, the only way to make a female Chosen would have her 'body' look exactly the same as a guys anyways, only the face is different, which means ugly as sin, which you don't want because it doesn't fit into YOUR idea of a female. Same reason why no one would argue for females if the main chaos class was Nurgle, because then they'd be all fat and bloated and ugly.

Are we watching the same intro? Because in the intro the Chaos champion is waaaay bigger than the priest. And not just height, but width and depth. Look when he brings his knee up into his side.

And you still haven't posted links to any decent female chaos champions. The best one so far is from a comic and that is just because the shoulder pads are completely disproportional to the rest of her body which is, again, simply a Dark Elf in heavy armor.

Yet again you invent arguments that no one argued about. No one said they wanted a sexy chosen. We want a realistic rendition of a buff female warrior with heavy armor.

And you complain about fanart with shoulder armor that is too big? The shoulderpads are the very thing that makes a chosen, together with their fancy helmets. Without them they'd look like a regular knight. So how come you suddenly complain about them when they are on a female? It is the horned silhouette of a person clad in ornate chaos armor, wielding a huge axe which is what constitutes a chosen, and it is those features that distinguishes them from any other warrior and makes them iconic. Those features could easily be applied to a female chosen.

I don't find the chosen in the intro to look as the behemoth you want to make him out to be. Not at all. Neither do I find the guy I linked in a screenshot to be either. But even so, we're not arguing whether a chosen should be big or not. The argument is whether a female warrior can fit in as a chosen warrior for her chaos god, and still look iconic. I very much think so, for reasons listed above.

The fact that you people can't seem to imagine chaos armor fit for a warrior woman boggles the mind. Is there even any lore reason to back up your superstition? Or is it just that you can't possibly tolerate a less attractive barbarian type female?


I'm going to photoshop the thickest, ugliest warrior woman chosen I can come up with, and you'll still easily be able to distinguish her female features - the theory here being that if I can make anything resembling a horrible female chosen in 10min, Mythic would be able to do the concept justice.

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n85/Zzulu/jtj.jpg

Shock horror, it has hips! And it will lop your god damn head off.

[Gloovish]

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n85/Zzulu/jtj.jpg

Shock horror, it has hips! And it will lop your god damn head off.
That looks awesome.

[Flegler]

Aye, nice job Zzulu. What was the body originally? A Sister of Battle?

Got to disagree here though:
And you complain about fanart with shoulder armor that is too big? The shoulderpads are the very thing that makes a chosen, together with their fancy helmets. Without them they'd look like a regular knight.

Chosen are significantly bulkier than normal humans, their frames are broader than anyone could naturally attain, even with the armour. Even so I don't see why the same template couldn't be applied to a woman.

[FoulPet]

A google search

Kinda looks like a Marauder. Was listed as a female kinda hard to tell.
http://www.sascha-herm.com/Chaos-Champion02a.jpg

Female beast"man".
http://www.coolminiornot.com/store/shopimages/cmon008_1.jpg

Chaos woman after mutations
http://www.gamerevolution.com/images/misc/spider_woman.jpg

Why not full plate?
Reasonable
http://img369.imageshack.us/img369/8895/femalefissure1fo.jpg
Bulky
http://dcwj.deviantart.com/art/Female-Knight-67616105
Cool
http://shiramune.deviantart.com/art/Female-Deathknight-67243284

OMGFA
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n85/Zzulu/jtj.jpg

[Zzulu]

Aye, nice job Zzulu. What was the body originally? A Sister of Battle?


Yeah. Can't go wrong with those.

[Boulvae]

The fact that you people can't seem to imagine chaos armor fit for a warrior woman boggles the mind. Is there even any lore reason to back up your superstition? Or is it just that you can't possibly tolerate a less attractive barbarian type female?
I CAN imagine chaos armour for a female Chosen, but geuss what? It'd be barely indistiguishable from the male counterpart.


Now I must say that photoshop photo was pretty good, BUT, th MAIN problem with your examples of your vision (and almost everyone elses for that matter) IS THE BLOODY TORSO!!! The plates for the torso would still have to be generally same in design that being obviously wider then the torso (the torso is leather on this one so...), you see if we went by your allusion to acomodate the person bestowed with these chaos armour gifts then that means all our chosen are fat bloated dudes under those big breast plates.

The angle of the collar clashes with the angle of the torso's angle by the way for some critiqe for your work in general, nothing to do with this argument.

[Arijharn]

I blame the entire factual argument for Female Chosen on a single chapter from Trollslayer, because other than that I have never heard of a Female CHOSEN. That said, I personally have nothing against female Chosen and feel that they could be worked in thematically (but then a gain I wouldn't be playing a female chosen even if they are available),


I used to agree with this line of thinking but in one of the old incarnations of this horse, a link was posted of a couple of Liber Chaotica images of female Chaos Warriors... and they managed to look more than a little badass and not in the least bit sexy.

The problem is this though; they would all be textures and signifying sex in texture modelling wouldn't be what I would call the most efficient way of doing things, especially since you can't tell things like texture in a distance, not all computers can handle textures as well as others (even with a LOD system) and using textures as the only way to differentiate females and males I think would be a cheap way out (i.e., not entirely professional).

[Gloovish]

So far http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n85/Zzulu/jtj.jpg is the only pic that might be acceptable as a female chosen, although not a high tier chosen.

@ZZulu: If you want to convince people make more pictures. No amount of words can make the skeptics imagine a female chosen that is "choseny" enough. If you can make a female chosen as cool as http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/media/wallpaper/full/WAR_wl_0507_01.jpg I'm sold.

[WNxKenwayy]

Take a male chosen, take your female rendition. Stand them side by side. In accordance to Mythic's idea of silhouetting, they should be the same height, width, and depth. Your's simply isn't even close.

STOP COMPARING IT TO A FEMALE IN PLATE ARMOR. Do you compare a Chosen to a Knight of the Blazing Sun just in black instead of silver? If you do you need to stop posting here and get your eyesight checked.

In order for a female chosen to be accepted you need both the lore (of which there is what, 1 mention in some book compared to the other 99.9% of lore where it isn't?) and the look of the current male chosen model. And stop posting pictures of just the current Chosen standing by themselves. Of course it doesn't look that big, there's nothing to compare it too.

Yes a Chosen's shoulder pads are larger than say a KotBS, but that is NOT what makes them Chosen. Why? Because unlike every female model/picture posted so far they also have the Shoulders, Chest, Torso, legs, hands, feet to go along with them.
http://warhammer.tentonhammer.com/modules.php?full=1&set_albumName=album95&id=Chosen_group&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_photo.php
http://warhammer.tentonhammer.com/modules.php?full=1&set_albumName=album99&id=Magus&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_photo.php

The Maurader is supposed to be still 'big' but more by human standards, the Magus is standard height/weight/width. The Chosen is easily recognizable as 'bigger' in every way. Aside from your large shoulder pads all your female chosen artwork would look just like a female maurader/dark elf/whatever in heavy armor. A female chosen should be ugly, period. She needs to be just as tall, just as wide EVERYWHERE, and with just as much depth.

It isn't that you can't make a female character in heavy armor not look badass hardcore 'oh crap' type setup. There is boat loads of artwork to back that up. It's that you can't have them fit the silhouette, or at least I haven't seen any yet, or the lore of what a Chosen is/does/will do.

Yes I fully agree that the raping of lore that has occurred with female dwarves and Sorcerer's etc is bad and I don't agree with. I sincerely hope they change it, but it just isn't going to happen unfortunately. Which is all the more reason to make a stand for the Chosen which aside from one passage somewhere has been treated as a 'male only' if you will class. YES there are plenty of female's in Chaos's army, which WILL be represented. What there ISN'T is giant hulking walking tanks that are 8 feet tall with biceps the size of most knights, legs that could crush a dwarf, and 38DD with a 20 inch waist.

[Zzulu]

So far http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n85/Zzulu/jtj.jpg is the only pic that might be acceptable as a female chosen, although not a high tier chosen.

@ZZulu: If you want to convince people make more pictures. No amount of words can make the skeptics imagine a female chosen that is "choseny" enough. If you can make a female chosen as cool as http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/media/wallpaper/full/WAR_wl_0507_01.jpg I'm sold.

To make true concept art I'd have to have a tablet, so I could draw upon my own inspiration. Photoshop does not quite suffice on its own, you know? :-(

Hopefully the image will at least make the nay-sayers think twice about the whole thing, and maybe admit that if mythic bothered, they could make it work.;)

[Zzulu]

Take a male chosen, take your female rendition. Stand them side by side. In accordance to Mythic's idea of silhouting, they should be the same height, width, and depth. Your's simply isn't even close.

STOP COMPARING IT TO A FEMALE IN PLATE ARMOR. Do you compare a Chosen to a Knight of the Blazing Sun just in black instead of silver? If you do you need to stop posting here and get your eyesight checked.

In order for a female chosen to be accepted you need both the lore (of which there is what, 1 mention in some book compared to the other 99.9% of lore where it isn't?) and the look of the current male chosen model. And stop posting pictures of just the current Chosen standing by themselves. Of course it doesn't look that big, there's nothing to compare it too.

Yes a Chosen's shoulder pads are larger than say a KotBS, but that is NOT what makes them Chosen. Why? Because unlike every female model/picture posted so far they also have the Shoulders, Chest, Torso, legs, hands, feet to go along with them.
http://warhammer.tentonhammer.com/modules.php?full=1&set_albumName=album95&id=Chosen_group&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_photo.php
http://warhammer.tentonhammer.com/modules.php?full=1&set_albumName=album99&id=Magus&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_photo.php

The Maurader is supposed to be still 'big' but more by human standards, the Magus is standard height/weight/width. The Chosen is easily recognizable as 'bigger' in every way. Aside from your large shoulder pads all your female chosen artwork would look just like a female maurader/dark elf/whatever in heavy armor. A female chosen should be ugly, period. She needs to be just as tall, just as wide EVERYWHERE, and with just as much depth.

Yes I fully agree that the raping of lore that has occurred with female dwarves and Sorcerer's etc is bad and I don't agree with. Which is all the more reason to make a stand for the Chosen which aside from one passage somewhere has been treated as a 'male only' if you will class. YES there are plenty of female's in Chaos's army, which WILL be represented. What there ISN'T is giant hulking walking tanks with 38DD and a 20 inch waist.

I'm not sure why you're so opposed to the idea, but if you really think that the female chosen I put forward wouldn't be instantly recognizable on the battlefield as a female chosen, (which is all that matters) then I guess we just have to agree to disagree. :p

[Boulvae]

It would be, but in the wrong ways. ONE thing about is this, NO HOUR GLASS body types.

Mythic can't make Chosen females easily recognisable without tossing the whole iconic look they are going for.

[WNxKenwayy]

I'm not sure why you're so opposed to the idea, but if you really think that the female chosen I put forward wouldn't be instantly recognizable on the battlefield as a female chosen, then I guess we just have to agree to disagree. :p

Put her in a jumble with these:
http://warhammer.tentonhammer.com/modules.php?set_albumName=album124&id=Witch_Elf_1&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_photo.php

and aside from the skin showing (which for all we know could be covered up with heavier armor) and you have the same basic size/shape/whatever. Put a Chosen next to anything else and you have exactly that, a Chosen next to something else.

It isn't that your artwork couldn't be recognized as a female chosen, its that she couldn't be recognized as a Chosen. Female has little to do with it in regards to your picture. She isn't tall/thick/width/depth/etc enough to match up to the male counterpart. I wish you luck in either finding an example or making one yourself, but there simply isn't any that has been posted that makes you think "oh that's a Chosen" before you think "Oh that's a female".

[FoulPet]

http://www.jetrefilm.com/shroud1_lo-res.jpg

http://www.jetrefilm.com/shroud2_lo-res.jpg
Interesting that this female has a few nice curves but no HUGE bumps.

This rox
http://www.volny.cz/grex/vyrobky/zbroj/z0008_e.htm

http://bexter.adkinssoftware.com/vaarmour3.jpg

Kinda funny
http://www.geocities.com/lyanna96/pics/weararmour.jpg

[Taurth]

Good job Zzulu. After seeing that I decided to make one of my own pretty much the same way you did.

I thought yours was a little too thin however, so I made one that imo looks more fitting with the males size: http://aycu21.webshots.com/image/39740/2003840921415070154_rs.jpg

[Zzulu]

Put her in a jumble with these:
http://warhammer.tentonhammer.com/mo...view_photo.php (http://warhammer.tentonhammer.com/modules.php?set_albumName=album124&id=Witch_Elf_1&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_photo.php)

and aside from the skin showing (which for all we know could be covered up with heavier armor) and you have the same basic size/shape/whatever. Put a Chosen next to anything else and you have exactly that, a Chosen next to something else.

It isn't that your artwork couldn't be recognized as a female chosen, its that she couldn't be recognized as a Chosen. Female has little to do with it in regards to your picture. She isn't tall/thick/width/depth/etc enough to match up to the male counterpart. I wish you luck in either finding an example or making one yourself, but there simply isn't any that has been posted that makes you think "oh that's a Chosen" before you think "Oh that's a female".Well, that's where we disagree. If the axe from the depicted female chosen came at me I wouldn't mistake it for an elf or a human female. I'd see that it was a chaos warrior trying to sever my head and nothing else. She'd be thicker and taller than any other female in the game, and wearing incredibly iconic armor, which I think would be enough.

I don't quite get your argument about the sex of a chosen on the battlefield and you linking that DE witch elf. Perhaps you are arguing the fact that you want Chosen to be so big that they are instantly recognizable on the battlefield? Well, a female chosen would stand out in such a way since she's the biggest female, just like the chosen is the biggest male. The only difference is in the width of the characters, and I doubt that would confuse the poor players of WAR to such an extent that they'd mistake the thing with Tzeentchian armor and red eyes for a half naked witch elf.

You seem to be arguing the fact that if it looks female and you recognize it as such first and foremost, that it is a bad thing?

Of course it's going to look female if it is female. The only thing that matters is that the player recognises his enemy as the class it is. This is the only thing of value to the actual game.

[Boulvae]

You don't get it, the Chosen are meant to be recognisable as hugely armour, BEHEMOTHS. Hour glass bodied big weaponized woman won't do, and this whole "obviously bigger and taller" thing wouldn't cut it, they'd have to be significantly BULKIER. Your examples are missing the bulk AND the proper torso for the iconic look thats gonna be used in WAR.

[Zzulu]

No, I'm sorry, but you're not getting it. Try to grasp the fact that the female would be the female variant of 'the huge and hulking behemoth'. She is still larger, bulkier and more intimidating than any other female out there, and is such instantly recognizable. There are hardly many curves on the depicted Female chosen, and those that are there are well within reason (and lore)

However, you seem to not want anything less than an identical replica of the male counterpart.;)

[FoulPet]

Wanna bet money these women could kick most peeps arses in this forum
http://www.onewaysystem.com/images/olimpiak_albuma/valentina.jpg
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2004-08/15/xin_4708011508458121248218.jpg
http://www.hantelparty.de/xt/female-bodybuilder.gif

Putem in full plate and givem an axe .

[Zzulu]

Wanna bet money these women could kick most peeps arses in this forum
http://www.onewaysystem.com/images/olimpiak_albuma/valentina.jpg
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2004-08/15/xin_4708011508458121248218.jpg
http://www.hantelparty.de/xt/female-bodybuilder.gif

That last one kind of scares me a little

[Boulvae]

I see, so thats how it is...

http://bexter.adkinssoftware.com/vaarmour3.jpg

Take that, bulk it up, slap some DARK blue with weathered metal, thicken the armour quite a bit, add Tzeentchian decals all over (or not), add spikey bits, make them menacing and glaring at you with piercing glowing eyes, put a weapon in hand, and last but not least a funky helmet and there you go.

Not much of a difference but THAT would be the female counterpart or closer to it if they WERE gonna be in.

EDIT: Forgot, leave the shoulder pads and there you go, and noticable at first glance difference.

[FoulPet]

She's more man than most men.

Women living in harsh areas doing most of the work because all then men are off drinking beer. Its crazy to think that at least a few women do not have the ability to defend their homes.

Even the Warhammer guys said that EVERYONE fights.

To think "Norse type" women are a push over in combat is like saying goblins are smurfs.

Women have fighting classes in all races. So Why can a human female be corrupted.

[Boulvae]

I was dissapointed to, BUT in the end there wouldn't BE that much of a difference for the Chosen.

The Marauders on the other hand... of couse like Zzulu sad that last one is scarey and sends the chills. Which baffles me still because that'd be GREAT for chaos.

[Tea TIme With Death]

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n85/Zzulu/jtj.jpg

Shock horror, it has hips! And it will lop your god damn head off.


make her twice as thick and we got a deal, she is badass but not a behemoth yet.

[WNxKenwayy]

Well, that's where we disagree. If the axe from the depicted female chosen came at me I wouldn't mistake it for an elf or a human female. I'd see that it was a chaos warrior trying to sever my head and nothing else. She'd be thicker and taller than any other female in the game, and wearing incredibly iconic armor, which I think would be enough.

I don't quite get your argument about the sex of a chosen on the battlefield and you linking that DE witch elf. Perhaps you are arguing the fact that you want Chosen to be so big that they are instantly recognizable on the battlefield? Well, a female chosen would stand out in such a way since she's the biggest female, just like the chosen is the biggest male. The only difference is in the width of the characters, and I doubt that would confuse the poor players of WAR to such an extent that they'd mistake the thing with Tzeentchian armor and red eyes for a half naked witch elf.

You seem to be arguing the fact that if it looks female and you recognize it as such first and foremost, that it is a bad thing?

Of course it's going to look female if it is female. The only thing that matters is that the player recognises his enemy as the class it is. This is the only thing of value to the actual game.


DING DING DING!!!!! That's EXACTLY what I, and mythic for that matter, want with a Chosen. You should be able to take a picture of 50vs50 from mid distance and be able to instantly pick out the Chosen, that's their design. A female Chosen would have to be EQUAL to her male counterpart (of which there isn't. In fact "Such creatures are so potent and so mutated they can scarcely be called human any longer.") not smaller. Otherwise it looks stupid and breaks the silhouetting rule of tanks looking like tanks. Yes she might look like a FEMALE tank, but that's not what Mythic is going for. They are going for tanks, that happen to be female as well. If a female Chosen is the biggest female but still smaller than say a Choppa or a KotBS she is no longer the 'Chosen' silhouette. The ONLY thing that should be bigger than a Chosen should be a Black Orc, and even then not by very much. So far no one has posted a design that is. Then of course you have to deal with the Lore, though sadly that seems to be less important than it used to be :(

Every model is designed for the Class to be recognized first, not the gender. If the class just so happens to be different BECAUSE of the gender, well then of course that's why they look more feminine/masculine.

[FoulPet]

Every model is designed for the Class to be recognized first, not the gender. If the class just so happens to be different BECAUSE of the gender, well then of course that's why they look more feminine/masculine.

So far all the dwarves look almost the same to me and distance will make that even worse.

[WNxKenwayy]

She's more man than most men.

Women living in harsh areas doing most of the work because all then men are off drinking beer. Its crazy to think that at least a few women do not have the ability to defend their homes.

Even the Warhammer guys said that EVERYONE fights.

To think "Norse type" women are a push over in combat is like saying goblins are smurfs.

Women have fighting classes in all races. So Why can a human female be corrupted.

Do you know anything of Warhammer Lore?

No one is arguing, in fact I very clearly stated quite the opposite, that women aren't in the armies of Chaos. In fact there are many of them, Slaanesh especially. They are very deadly yes.

What they AREN'T is huge, muscle bound, 8 foot tall, hulking giants of metal. THAT'S what a Chosen is, not a 'corrupted human male with black armor'. Look at the SS I posted. They are massive characters, on the scale of a Black Orc. They aren't 'strength' based models in the same fashion as a Chosen. They use style, finesse, charm, trickery, speed, etc to be deadly, not brute force. Its sexist as hell yes. But its also the Warhammer Lore. Just like not having black high elves is racist, its also simply the way it is in Warhammer.

[Infallius_Daemonium]

So far all the dwarves look almost the same to me and distance will make that even worse.

Don't worry, all the males have massive/large beards, all the females don't. Its pretty obvious. ;)

[WNxKenwayy]

So far all the dwarves look almost the same to me and distance will make that even worse.

Crap, should have clarified my stance. I meant for the 'iconic' classes. Bright Wizard, Magus, Chosen, Black Orc, Archmage, etc. Very true that most all dwarf's look the same, no argument there. All 'dwarves' are the same, small, stout, etc. Their classes are more separated by smaller things, like beards, weapons, etc. That matches with the Lore, there really isn't any way to separate them such as the difference between say a Goblin and a Black Orc.

[The Penguin Hunter]

So far http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n85/Zzulu/jtj.jpg is the only pic that might be acceptable as a female chosen, although not a high tier chosen.

@ZZulu: If you want to convince people make more pictures. No amount of words can make the skeptics imagine a female chosen that is "choseny" enough. If you can make a female chosen as cool as http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/media/wallpaper/full/WAR_wl_0507_01.jpg I'm sold.


The picture you shown that female chosen is definitly not bulky enough

[Arijharn]

I'm a little confused, since Liber Chaotica is generally accepted as being the epitome of 'lore' for the sake of argument and they (female Chaos Warriors) are in it. The fact that basically every miniature you buy out there are males probably has more to do with:

a) Chaos/Warhammer target market (GW research points as males as their most popular customers, no surprise there I'm guessing).
b) cost prohibitive; would going out and concepting and modelling female Chaos Warriors and then putting them into production add any real sense of value to their line? Namely would anyone really care?
c) Our own perceptives and views of society. Yes, okay, everyone can grasp the concept of women defending their homes and loved ones. But realistically if you lined up the biggest bulkiest woman vs. the biggest bulkiest man, then the woman is going to be dwarfed by the man anyway, and yes this is the design and concept of a Chaos Warrior. Especially the Chosen, which is supposed to be the biggest baddest Chaos Warrior's short of becoming Champions.

I know I've been sidetracked, but no one (at least, those who actually know the 'lore') dismisses female Chaos Warriors because they don't exist, but rather they dismiss them because they are just not iconic enough, especially in stereotypical representation (for example; Viking women apparently existed, but no where in mass media are they represented, thus it's not common knowledge they fought. Think of it as the 'eye of the beholder' sort of thing. In other words; people just aren't motivated enough to care to research it afterwards, they just want to be entertained.)

[WNxKenwayy]

No ones doubting there are Female Chaos Warriors. There just aren't Female Chosen as depicted and intended by Mythic.

http://uk.games-workshop.com/hordesofchaos/wallpapers/images/wp07-800x600.jpg (http://uk.games-workshop.com/hordesofchaos/slaanesh/images/cult-art.jpg)

Is a perfect example of a female chaos warrior. Though honestly, that would make one HELL of a female Marauder.

[FoulPet]

Do you know anything of Warhammer Lore?

Some but I wouldn't make a living at it.

What they AREN'T is huge, muscle bound, 8 foot tall, hulking giants of metal.

Where in lore does it state this as fact? Since the game is created and mostly played by males you would figure most of the Lords, Champions ect... All around bad Arse guys would of course be male.

What I think you fail to perceive is the discussion that in the warhammer world it would totally be possible for a female to fill this role just as good as a male.

If we are also talking about lords like Tzeentch, Slaanesh and lets add Nurgle I see no reason why any of these would not consider a female. Khorne however being all full of demonic testosterone might be gender bias.


They use style, finesse, charm, trickery, speed, etc to be deadly, not brute force.

http://www.funnyphotos.net.au/userimages/user756_1153371702.jpg

This woman would snap you like a twig

No ones doubting there are Female Chaos Warriors. There just aren't Female Chosen as depicted and intended by Mythic.

http://uk.games-workshop.com/hordesofchaos/wallpapers/images/wp07-800x600.jpg (http://uk.games-workshop.com/hordesofchaos/slaanesh/images/cult-art.jpg)

Is a perfect example of a female chaos warrior. Though honestly, that would make one HELL of a female Marauder.

Don't you start as a chaos warrior and if you prove yourself you get a promotion to Chosen, lord, daemon?

[Arijharn]

What I think you fail to perceive is the discussion that in the warhammer world it would totally be possible for a female to fill this role just as good as a male.


Actually, I think you're the one failing to perceive that he isn't arguing against their existence, he's arguing that as far as actual sources go, you can't have a Chosen that is classically chosen in appearance and description and still be female. I think you should go back and re-read what he has typed in the past.

Lorewise we're saying your right, but artistic license hasn't been good enough in the examples thus far given to make you think that's a Chosen, as opposed to first going 'that's a female.' If anything, first glance should be more to do with the Chosen acceptance, the fact that the pictures that people have shown in the incarnation of this horse and others of it's stable further proves the disunity in what makes up a valid 'female' variant than whether it's started in lore or not. I.e., the fact that many people have differing ideas of what makes a female Chosen a female is probably a good representation of Mythic's own process before they decided to scrap the idea entirely. Compare this to the male variant and everyone says that's badass... they don't say; that's badass... and obviously male. Well, I didn't anyway I just stopped at badass.

[WNxKenwayy]

Some but I wouldn't make a living at it.



Where in lore does it state this as fact? Since the game is created and mostly played by males you would figure most of the Lords, Champions ect... All around bad Arse guys would of course be male.

What I think you fail to perceive is the discussion that in the warhammer world it would totally be possible for a female to fill this role just as good as a male.

If we are also talking about lords like Tzeentch, Slaanesh and lets add Nurgle I see no reason why any of these would not consider a female. Khorne however being all full of demonic testosterone might be gender bias.




http://www.funnyphotos.net.au/userimages/user756_1153371702.jpg

This woman would snap you like a twig



Don't you start as a chaos warrior and if you prove yourself you get a promotion to Chosen, lord, daemon?

Its not done because most of the players are male. Its because in human history the fighters/warriors are male. Very few exceptions exist but it doesn't matter. Humans relate to our history. History tells us men fight violently more than women, and in a fight to the death a man will beat a women. You want to post up picures of roided up females I just post pictures of even bigger roided up men. Its history and biology. That's why all the models/artwork/pictures through out history of female warriors have protrayed them as fighters who win through guile and finesse because they can't win on brute force alone against a man. All of that has nothing to do with this discussion though.

For the love of god please I beg of you read my post, in their entirety. Yes a female chaos warrior could server a role as a 'tank'. She could use blades to parry (sword dancer anyone?), her guile to charm so you can't attack, etc. What she couldn't do, in the lore, is stand there, towering over you, using her size and strength alone to tank.

Slaanesh is WELL known for using females in his army, heck the picture I posted was from the GW webpage for Slaanesh. Slaanesh isn't a brute force fighter like Khorne so it fits. And yes I'm sure Tzeentch employs female warriors as well. Please stop thinking I don't believe in females in the Chaos armies. I do, trust me.

It isn't that a female couldn't reach the same command level as a Chosen (basically a Champion as described by Mythic). Its that she couldn't LOOK like one which is important in this game for silhouetting and getting that iconic look. No artwork posted yet even comes close to the size/scope of the Chosen models or intentions for them that mythic has stated.

[The Penguin Hunter]

Well the problem is, is the "What you see is what you get rule"

Which the translation is, if they make a female chosen, it would have to be a hulking mirror of it's male counter part

[FoulPet]

Actually, I think you're the one failing to perceive that he isn't arguing against their existence, he's arguing that as far as actual sources go, you can't have a Chosen that is classically chosen in appearance and description and still be female. I think you should go back and re-read what he has typed in the past.

Ok if I have failed to totally comprehend all of the post Im sorry but, I still fail to see how a tank with or without boobs is any less huge.

I am 6'3" 195 and a woman came in to our warehouse today and she was taller than me and I bet was pretty close to the same weight.

I fail to see any logic telling me a woman can not be as large as a man.

Now to be fair it is not common but it also is not impossible.
Well the problem is, is the "What you see is what you get rule"

Which the translation is, if they make a female chosen, it would have to be a hulking mirror of it's male counter part

Ok gimme the same model with a femalish voice and Ill name it Betty.

[The Penguin Hunter]

Ok gimme the same model with a femalish voice and Ill name it Betty.


You misunderstood, I suggest you think about it because I wont explain it for you

[FoulPet]

You misunderstood, I suggest you think about it because I wont explain it for you

Thinking is to hard. I'll just continue without that burden.

[Ralzar]

I CAN imagine chaos armour for a female Chosen, but geuss what? It'd be barely indistiguishable from the male counterpart.


Not sure what everyone else wants, but THAT's what I want. It can be a copy-n-paste of the male model for all I care, as long as the games character creator allows you to choose "female" as an option.

What female chosen look like is up to Mythic, I just don't want there to be no female chosen at all.

[Arijharn]

Personally I'd rather there isn't a sex at all at selection (even if it's defaulted to 'male' I think is a bit of a slur.)

In fact, I really hope they don't even use a gender qualifer at all in quest text either. Okay sure that would be a little awkward for the Dark Elves but for the Greenskins and Chaos (well, specifically the Chosen and Marauders in any case) that seems rather okay to me.

[Taurth]

Heres a more finished version of my bulkier female Chosen. What do people think?

http://aycu19.webshots.com/image/41338/2001627333202722920_rs.jpg

[Arijharn]

Heres a more finished version of my bulkier female Chosen. What do people think?

http://aycu19.webshots.com/image/41338/2001627333202722920_rs.jpg

I know it sounds odd in regards to being mentioned in the same sentence as a Chaos follower, but I think the hips are out of proportion to the point of being exaggerated to fit being female. Other than that, I think it's fine.

It certainly fulfills at least to me the first qualifier of being a Chosen (i.e., badass) and then it's 'Hips, it must be female.' I suppose any deciding vote would have to wait to a model of course. I know this sounds somewhat contradictory to my earlier statements, but perhaps having more obvious gender traits would be welcome as well, without going to the realm of skin tight plate bikini.

[Estebar]

Personally I'd rather there isn't a sex at all at selection (even if it's defaulted to 'male' I think is a bit of a slur.)

In fact, I really hope they don't even use a gender qualifer at all in quest text either. Okay sure that would be a little awkward for the Dark Elves but for the Greenskins and Chaos (well, specifically the Chosen and Marauders in any case) that seems rather okay to me. I agree. According to Paul Barnett, the Chosen is essentially supposed to be a squiggly mass of mutations strapped into a suit of Chaos Armour in the first place. Just make most of the Chosen voice samples are androgynous hisses, rasps and multiple vocal tones layered over one another, some high and some low, and you've got something you can work with.

Lore-wise, yes, Tzeentch is bizarre and his Chosen and Champions should look suitably bizarre in shape. Nothing practical at all. In "Riders of the Dead", for instance, there was a Champion of Tzeentch who was essentially a highly-intelligent foetus strapped to the chest of a mindless armoured giant. For the sake of the game however, which has to bring some shape to Tzeentch's shapelessness, I suppose they've given the Chosen the most appropriate silhouette for his role as a tank. Father Jack's female Chosen makes for a good suggestion. Her torso has notable layers of plating over it, which suits the unnatural morphing symbiotic metal which Chaos Armour is supposed to be made out of, but in order to make sure that Chaos isn't overdone, it looks like the devs have stuck to the golden rule when making a good MMO (K.I.S.S. - Keep It Simple Stupid). This rule is very important for Chaos.

By the way, the other Chaos lore bible is Tome of Corruption - a Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay book focused on all things Chaos, and I'm pretty sure it allows you to make a variety of armoured female Chaos characters including Chosen, but I'll have to go home and double-check that to confirm it as fact.

[Ralzar]

By the way, the other Chaos lore bible is Tome of Corruption - a Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay book focused on all things Chaos, and I'm pretty sure it allows you to make a variety of armoured female Chaos characters including Chosen, but I'll have to go home and double-check that to confirm it as fact.

Yup, in the description of the chaos warrior career, they're described as "men and women".

[Walter Black]

Um, I'll admit that I only did a cursory skim of this thread, but has Mythic officially changed their minds on female Chosen? I haven't seen anything else about it.

[Taurth]

I think some very slight curves in the main piece of chest armor around the hips like the picture I linked above, larger hips along with a slight scaling down (only marginally, we still want her to be taller than an Empire male) and we'd have a decent looking female Chosen.Um, I'll admit that I only did a cursory skim of this thread, but has Mythic officially changed their minds on female Chosen? I haven't seen anything else about it. No, but there was an interview where a developer said this on a question about female Black Gaurds:

"Thats a good question. I honestly don't know. I don't know because theres some things up for debate right now as far as some of the *pauses* other than Greenskins ofcourse they have no sex, some of the choices that we've made as far as whether a class or career can have one sex or both sexes has come under criticisms, so theres some that obviously for example like the Witch Elf, theres no way a Witch Elf will be a male Witch Elf but theres others like the Chosen and some things that are kinda ambiguous where in the Games Workshop War theres never necessarily been a female version but theres never been anything that said that there couldn't be, so there is some ambiguity right now as far as the choices for some of the careers. As far as the Black Gaurd right now, there may be a choice. I honestly don't know what that is."

Which could mean they're looking into it. They're probably considering it atleast.

[Zzulu]

I hope they'll pull it off. Variety is always welcome.

[Estebar]

"Thats a good question. I honestly don't know. I don't know because theres some things up for debate right now as far as some of the *pauses* other than Greenskins ofcourse they have no sex, some of the choices that we've made as far as whether a class or career can have one sex or both sexes has come under criticisms, so theres some that obviously for example like the Witch Elf, theres no way a Witch Elf will be a male Witch Elf but theres others like the Chosen and some things that are kinda ambiguous where in the Games Workshop War theres never necessarily been a female version but theres never been anything that said that there couldn't be, so there is some ambiguity right now as far as the choices for some of the careers. As far as the Black Gaurd right now, there may be a choice. I honestly don't know what that is."

Which could mean they're looking into it. They're probably considering it atleast. I've never heard that before. I must say, that is very promising indeed.

The fact that they have recently included a keen division between Sorceror and Sorceress classes, giving them both unique names and clothing depending on the gender you initially choose at character creation, does show that they have the potential to do something similar for the Chosen/Marauder. Perhaps not with the name, but with the clothing and silhouette.

[Ralzar]

"Thats a good question. I honestly don't know. I don't know because theres some things up for debate right now as far as some of the *pauses* other than Greenskins ofcourse they have no sex, some of the choices that we've made as far as whether a class or career can have one sex or both sexes has come under criticisms, so theres some that obviously for example like the Witch Elf, theres no way a Witch Elf will be a male Witch Elf but theres others like the Chosen and some things that are kinda ambiguous where in the Games Workshop War theres never necessarily been a female version but theres never been anything that said that there couldn't be, so there is some ambiguity right now as far as the choices for some of the careers. As far as the Black Gaurd right now, there may be a choice. I honestly don't know what that is."

Which could mean they're looking into it. They're probably considering it atleast.


Yeah, I remember that. It does atleast show that they're aware of the problem.

[Tyurion]

I'm going to photoshop the thickest, ugliest warrior woman chosen I can come up with, and you'll still easily be able to distinguish her female features - the theory here being that if I can make anything resembling a horrible female chosen in 10min, Mythic would be able to do the concept justice.

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n85/Zzulu/jtj.jpg

Shock horror, it has hips! And it will lop your god damn head off.
Nice but you could have got rid of the frag greandes

[Gloovish]

To make true concept art I'd have to have a tablet, so I could draw upon my own inspiration. Photoshop does not quite suffice on its own, you know? :-(

No excuses. Buy a tablet.

Heres a more finished version of my bulkier female Chosen. What do people think?

http://aycu19.webshots.com/image/41338/2001627333202722920_rs.jpg

Doesn't seem that different from a male chosen. Maybe you could make a helmless female chosen so that we could see if it looks weird or ok.

[Taurth]

Just made a final one. Cant be bothered to make anymore. :p

I thought the last looked a little too bulky. This ones inbetween Zzulu's version and mine:

http://aycu20.webshots.com/image/38699/2001134153026445527_rs.jpg

[Tea TIme With Death]

EDIT: no need to react in such a way.

[Estebar]

I'd say female Marauders are a little easier to design.

You can take any of the male Marauder designs with the criss-cross straps across the chest (examples 1 (http://mythicmktg.fileburst.com/war/us/media/images/careers/Marauder_01.jpg), 2 (http://mythicmktg.fileburst.com/war/us/media/images/careers/Marauder_03.jpg) & 3 (http://mythicmktg.fileburst.com/war/us/media/images/careers/marauder_model.jpg)) and simply lift them up to cover the breasts with the lower parts of the straps. Simple really. Then replace the bushy beard with bushy hair or lots and lots of braids.

Most of the Marauder's strength is really coming from his mutations anyway, so a female could qualify to fight just as hard as a male in that respect because gifts from Tzeentch give unnatural strength to anyone regardless of gender.

"Awww, look at the cute lil girly-girly trying to be a Witch Elf! That's right honey, you just keep on swinging that axe! Makes you jiggle faster! And... what's happening to your arm? AAAAAAAAAAAARGH!" *crunch, slice, smash, stab, stab, stab, slam*

[WNxKenwayy]

I'd say female Marauders are a little easier to design.

You can take any of the male Marauder designs with the criss-cross straps across the chest (examples 1 (http://mythicmktg.fileburst.com/war/us/media/images/careers/Marauder_01.jpg), 2 (http://mythicmktg.fileburst.com/war/us/media/images/careers/Marauder_03.jpg) & 3 (http://mythicmktg.fileburst.com/war/us/media/images/careers/marauder_model.jpg)) and simply lift them up to cover the breasts with the lower parts of the straps. Simple really. Then replace the bushy beard with bushy hair or lots and lots of braids.

Most of the Marauder's strength is really coming from his mutations anyway, so a female could qualify to fight just as hard as a male in that respect because gifts from Tzeentch give unnatural strength to anyone regardless of gender.

"Awww, look at the cute lil girly-girly trying to be a Witch Elf! That's right honey, you just keep on swinging that axe! Makes you jiggle faster! And... what's happening to your arm? AAAAAAAAAAAARGH!" *crunch, slice, smash, stab, stab, stab, slam*

That I completely agree with. Not just for Lore's sake (of which it is extremely easy to find mutated female 'marauders' if you will), but because they absolutely look the part. Twisted, cruved horns, maybe a tail, lithe bodies with spiky bits. Basically exactly like the artwork I posted. I would love to see that in game.

[Rathenau]

Its not done because most of the players are male. Its because in human history the fighters/warriors are male.My, I had to read through 5 pages to actually see someone tell us how it is. That said I would be very pissed as well if I couldn't play a career I wanted as my own gender. It's a good thing I don't like dark elf melee damage I suppose.

Anyway Taurth; the second version of your character, erm, composition, I think it was the second, (this one (http://aycu19.webshots.com/image/41338/2001627333202722920_rs.jpg)anyway) was really proving the point that the more bulk a woman gets while fully encased in armour the less likely you will be able to tell whatever or not she really is female. Off course same is true for a man, heck I’d even go as far as to say that it’ll be rather common place to mistake a fat and muscled suit of armour as being feminine. (Depending on what your ideal view of that is I assume)

Nor I'm not saying that would somehow validate the fact that there aren't going to be female chosen, I'm just saying that you'll have to accept that at least.

[Godric]

They don't have more of an emotional range, they ussually just understand them better. Once a female warriar/chosen/champion's body turns to dust it nolonger mattters.

AND that heavy armour may count, but it's not FULL PLATE, it'd be more scale mail or chainmail. The northman that are up north arn't as pale as her (i'd say she be albino), she'd fit the bill for a slaaneshi and she's still pretty not generic.

EDIT: AND i'm not arguing generic female in full plate, but heres the thing i've gotten one real female to wear full plate on halloween, wanna know the vissual difference? Height, either then that she coudld've been mistaken for a man if not for her voice.

NOW I'M arguing the iconicness, and general feel Chosen of WAR specifically, not generic females in general. May seem that way but i'm arguing against using regular females, which you seem to not be giving me or anyone else regular female examples, all you've been giving are stereotypical "feminine" featured heavy armour with some pretty faces on it excluding the sister of battle.

Skinny, and curvy heavy armour doesn't mean feminine all the time unless stereotyped, the Chosen's look for WAR is supposed to be iconic and hulking monsters. The females would obviously ALSO be hulking monsters with muscle,which is why they can't be done because they'd CAN'T be done justic prurely because the Chosen are FULLY body covered and their armour which is also overly large and imposing - not your typical heavy armour.

Seriously for a good example take a look at the lowest tier chosen's head size is in comparison to the armour, something nothing at all like the heavy armour examples you've given.

Very valid point, but then when it comes to taking off the helmets, thats when the choice comes into effect.

[Haager]

In all the research I did I think the best example of a female Chosen, would have to Lhunana from the Lord of Ruin book. In this title she is completely indistinguishable from any of the other Chosen until Malus knocked her helmet of.

That being said to me it wouldn't really matter one way, or the next in the game as long as they were "very" chosen looking. Much like some of the pictures we have seen. Just with a female head concept.

[FoulPet]

Nice but you could have got rid of the frag greandes

Those are the Holy Hand Grenades of Antioch.

I took a crack at it. yeah the colors are a little off and its a little rough.

I made her bigger than our current chosen.

http://img81.imageshack.us/my.php?image=chosen111gw3.jpg

[Godric]

Those are the Holy Hand Grenades of Antioch.

I took a crack at it. yeah the colors are a little off and its a little rough.

I made her bigger than our current chosen.

http://img81.imageshack.us/my.php?image=chosen111gw3.jpg

Now THAT is what female chosen shoudl look like. They look like chosen, but you can also tell that its a girl under all that steel and spikes. People big on Lore might object to it, but we've already covered that area as far as how closely the game will follow the Lore.

[Zzulu]

This is the only official GW concept art of a female chosen, from Liber Chaotica - Slaanesh;
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n85/Zzulu/FemaleCHosen.jpg

The only tell tale signs of it being a female is the less bulky form and the hair. (oh and the spikey slaanesh chest :D)

[Boulvae]

Which proves my point of how having a female Chosen would basically just be seen as a mirror of the male counter-part. Because the iconic look Mythic is going for they can't do female Chosen proper justice purely because it'd have to go against the very look they are trying to make for the Chosen just so they could make it distiguishable from the male counter part.

EDIT: corrected mirror

[Zzulu]

Except we showed earlier a few concept art examples of how you make a female chosen. Some thought it was good, others thought it needed to look exactly like the male.

We're not going to get further than that.

[Ralzar]

Which proves my point of how having a female Chosen would basically just be seen as a mirror of the male counter-part. Because the iconic look Mythic is going for they can't do female Chosen proper justice purely because it'd have to go against the very look they are trying to make for the Chosen just so they could make it distiguishable from the male counter part.

EDIT: corrected mirror

I'm not even getting what you're saying here. You seem to equate "doing female chosen justice" with having them be very distinctly feminine in shape compared to the male.
The picture posted above by Zzulu is nice, because it's big and bulky but at the same time noticably slimmer than the standard bulky male chosen.

[Boulvae]

...i'm not getting what your saying, I am basically saying that it wouldn't be possible to make a female Chosen without being mistaken for a male, hence why they can't be done proper justice.

Zzulu said it too (thus saving my breath for me) when she was showing an example of a Slaaneshi female chaos warrior, that it was recognised as female because of the less bulk and more sensuality.

A Chosen's gotta have the bulk, and apparently doesn't come with the sensuality from how Paul describes 'em.

[MrDreadful]

Personally, I thought the slightly slimmer Chosen looked just fine. Still massive and obviously a Chosen at a glance, but not overdone or suffering from the more power=less armor school of thought that plagues many fantasy settings.

[FoulPet]

Not allot to do with this topic but something i came across about females in combat.

Is it fact? Dunno but females fighting to the death in an arena is worth a look.

Gladiatrix documentary, as shown on the Discovery Channel

http://www.gladiatrix.info/multimedia/index.htm

[Drift3r]

First of all the title "Chosen" is not specific to big bulky armored warriors. In Warhammer lore anyone can be "Chosen" by the Chaos Gods. The title of "Chosen" simply refers to a person being selected as a candidate for eventual daemonhood. So anyone from a scrany wizard scheming for Tzeentch to a bezerker of Khorne ( armored or butt naked ) can be given the title of "Chosen". It seem people are misconstruing the word "Chosen" as a specific class in Warhammer lore when it is not so at all. The armored warriors you see in the TT are Chaos Warriors and while some maybe be "Chosen" not all "Chosen" are Chaos Warriors. Also there are examples of female Chaos Warriors in lore though they are not visualized on the TT or in graphic artwork but they are there.

There is no denying that they exist same as the female Knights of the Blazing Sun. Of course unlike the the fraud known as the female Warrior Priest of Sigmar ( of which is not a part of lore and has lore against it ) female Chaos Warriors aka..Chosen do exist and have been sited in lore. Also being that there are female Knights of the Blazing Sun's what is to say that none have not fallen pray to the temptations of the Chaos Gods? If Archaon, Lord of the End Times who is rumored to be a ex-Priest of Sigmar can be swayed to side to join and fight for the Chaos Gods then so could a female Warrior who once served the Empire.

Also this does not even take into account the many native Chaos Tribesmen/women who worship the Chaos Gods from birth.These people from birth are trained and honed to be warriors and devote followers of the Chaos Gods. Those who don't cut the mustard and who are seen to be weak are left to fend for themselves in the Chaos wastelands. These tribes are always warring and constantly on the move so everyone in a tribe has to be ready to hold their own be it man, woman, or child. Anyways here is the link to the video which has a Mythic fellow stating that they are reviewing gender choices for certain races.

http://files.filefront.com/eforallinterview+wswmv/;8864184;/fileinfo.html

[Boulvae]

In WAR the title of Chosen is specific, WAR is not Warhammer Fantasy it's in a different timeline.

We'll just see what Mythic will do in the end, I highly doubt the Mauraders won't be given the atempt again with the Chosen we'll see, maybe they'll just throw female voices and a female head for an option if helmets shown to be off... cop out way, but still a possibilty.

[WNxKenwayy]

First of all the title "Chosen" is not specific to big bulky armored warriors. In Warhammer lore anyone can be "Chosen" by the Chaos Gods. The title of "Chosen" simply refers to a person being selected as a candidate for eventual daemonhood. So anyone from a scrany wizard scheming for Tzeentch to a bezerker of Khorne ( armored or butt naked ) can be given the title of "Chosen". It seem people are misconstruing the word "Chosen" as a specific class in Warhammer lore when it is not so at all. The armored warriors you see in the TT are Chaos Warriors and while some maybe be "Chosen" not all "Chosen" are Chaos Warriors. Also there are examples of female Chaos Warriors in lore though they are not visualized on the TT or in graphic artwork but they are there.

There is no denying that they exist same as the female Knights of the Blazing Sun. Of course unlike the the fraud known as the female Warrior Priest of Sigmar ( of which is not a part of lore and has lore against it ) female Chaos Warriors aka..Chosen do exist and have been sited in lore. Also being that there are female Knights of the Blazing Sun's what is to say that none have not fallen pray to the temptations of the Chaos Gods? If Archaon, Lord of the End Times who is rumored to be a ex-Priest of Sigmar can be swayed to side to join and fight for the Chaos Gods then so could a female Warrior who once served the Empire.

Also this does not even take into account the many native Chaos Tribesmen/women who worship the Chaos Gods from birth.These people from birth are trained and honed to be warriors and devote followers of the Chaos Gods. Those who don't cut the mustard and who are seen to be weak are left to fend for themselves in the Chaos wastelands. These tribes are always warring and constantly on the move so everyone in a tribe has to be ready to hold their own be it man, woman, or child. Anyways here is the link to the video which has a Mythic fellow stating that they are reviewing gender choices for certain races.

http://files.filefront.com/eforallinterview+wswmv/;8864184;/fileinfo.html

You didn't read any of the post here did you? Every single thing you said has already been discussed and reasons given why and why not in regards to "yeah but chaos still has women in it". Yes, we know.

[Drift3r]

You didn't have to read my post then if what I said was already repeated nor respond too it all. Of course this is a discussion thread on female chosen so if you don't like hearing argument for or against even if they are the same ones I'd suggest you stop reading this thread if it pains you that much.

[WNxKenwayy]

You didn't have to read my post then if what I said was already repeated nor respond too it all. Of course this is a discussion thread on female chosen so if you don't like hearing argument for or against even if they are the same ones I'd suggest you stop reading this thread if it pains you that much.

I don't mind hearing arguements for or against it at all. What I do mind is hearing the same one 10x over because people are too lazy to read. Normal response to your post, cliff notes version

1. yes we know female chaos warrior/champs exist
2. there is artwork for them, most notably Slaanesh
3. we all agree females have a place in chaos's army
4. female marauders look badass
5. WAR is going for 'iconic' look for chosen
6. you can't have the 'iconic' chosen look in WAR in a female model

Take that, make each number about 2-3 paragraphs, and you have your full answer.

[Gloovish]

6. you can't have the 'iconic' chosen look in WAR in a female model


I remember I once saw a picture of a 'chosen' chaos female. It was some important powerful chaos woman who had the body of a snake from the waist down. I can't find the link.

[Rathenau]

Mmmh, only model that pops into my mind is this one (http://www.games-workshop.de/warhammer/voelker/chaos/artikel/vier-aspekte/bilder/slaaneshchamp.jpg), or converted like this (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/bananamantimfisher/2005_0531DLarmy0009.jpg). Course, if your talking about artwork I simply don't know.

[Ethandril]

I remember I once saw a picture of a 'chosen' chaos female. It was some important powerful chaos woman who had the body of a snake from the waist down. I can't find the link.


I think you mean her, Dechala, the Denied One (http://uk.games-workshop.com/hordesofchaos/special-characters/6/)

Some say that she was blessed with great age by Slaanesh, or maybe the legends that she was once a High Elf princess are true.

[Brother Cassius]

Is this still being talked about?

[Zzulu]

Is this still being talked about?

Yes.












Yes it is.

[Graven]

Those are the Holy Hand Grenades of Antioch.

I took a crack at it. yeah the colors are a little off and its a little rough.

I made her bigger than our current chosen.

http://img81.imageshack.us/my.php?image=chosen111gw3.jpg

Hmm, now there is something I can acknowledge. This is indeed some fearsome female chosen. She's a bit too skinny for that height, but at least is easily noticeable. I don't think anyone would mind having this in the game as female chosen... well actually, many people may mind, but it's the best up-to-now. At least in my own humble opinion :)

[Taurth]

Those are the Holy Hand Grenades of Antioch.

I took a crack at it. yeah the colors are a little off and its a little rough.

I made her bigger than our current chosen.

http://img81.imageshack.us/my.php?image=chosen111gw3.jpgMythic isn't going to design the famale Chosen in a completely different style of armour though. Their tiered armour will have to look alike with minor difference to show genders.

[FoulPet]

Mythic isn't going to design the famale Chosen in a completely different style of armour though. Their tiered armour will have to look alike with minor difference to show genders.

Yes I figured it would have to be the same but unfortunatly Im not a great artist and I had to frankenstein the image together.

I still think it can be done with minimal effort.

Since i have to see thier advertisement I figure its worth linking one of their pictures

http://www.nbc.com/American_Gladiators/images/photos/scet/1538/NUP_112957_0532.jpg

[Zzulu]

If I had the time I'd frankenstein my own image, but proper this time. However, everyone seems to have differing opinions of just how a female chosen should look like, so it's very difficult to make the perfect concept. Perhaps Mythic struggled with the same thing.

[Rathenau]

Aye, I'm sure they did and probably still are.

Regardless I know I really shouldn't say this as I've already learned it's never a good idea to discuss differences between sexes in any way, shape or form. Certainly not when my significant other might find out, but it seems I cannot help myself.

The images linked about female gladiators and present day fighting/sport woman are nice, but there is a reason they aren't mixed together with men. That being said, I personally wouldn't stand a chance against any of them, no matter what the sport. I was however thinking in more broader terms.

[FoulPet]

Aye, I'm sure they did and probably still are.


Regardless I know I really shouldn't say this as I've already learned it's never a good idea to discuss differences between sexes in any way, shape or form. Certainly not when my significant other might find out, but it seems I cannot help myself.


The images linked about female gladiators and present day fighting/sport woman are nice, but there is a reason they aren't mixed together with men. That being said, I personally wouldn't stand a chance against any of them, no matter what the sport. I was however thinking in more broader terms.


Give them both a sword and you have evened the odds a good bit.

[MrDreadful]

Also, in RPG land Men=Women when it comes to the character sheet. I played one where men got plus to toughness or something like that and women got plus to dex, but it was pushing it to use sex as another min/maxing tool.

[Romple-WHA]

i'd laugh my off if the female models were just copy/paste of the male models lol. Hey in 400000 lbs of armor how can you tell the difference?

[FoulPet]

From the report of the Presidential Commission on the Assignment of Women in the Armed Forces (report date November 15, 1992, published in book form by Brassey's in 1993):

"The average female Army recruit is 4.8 inches shorter, 31.7 pounds lighter, has 37.4 fewer pounds of muscle, and 5.7 more pounds of fat than the average male recruit. She has only 55 percent of the upper-body strength and 72 percent of the lower-body strength… An Army study of 124 men and 186 women done in 1988 found that women are more than twice as likely to suffer leg injuries and nearly five times as likely to suffer [stress] fractures as men."

Further: "The Commission heard an abundance of expert testimony about the physical differences between men and women that can be summarized as follows:
"Women's aerobic capacity is significantly lower, meaning they cannot carry as much as far as fast as men, and they are more susceptible to fatigue.
"In terms of physical capability, the upper five percent of women are at the level of the male median. The average 20-to-30 year-old woman has the same aerobic capacity as a 50 year-old man."

From the same report: "Lt Col. William Gregor, United States Army, testified before the Commission regarding a survey he conducted at an Army ROTC Advanced Summer Camp on 623 women and 3540 men. …Evidence Gregor presented to the Commission includes:

"(a) Using the standard Army Physical Fitness Test, he found that the upper quintile of women at West point achieved scores on the test equivalent to the bottom quintile of men.
"(c) Only 21 women out of the initial 623 (3.4%) achieved a score equal to the male mean score of 260.
"(d) On the push-up test, only seven percent of women can meet a score of 60, while 78 percent of men exceed it. "(e) Adopting a male standard of fitness at West Point would mean 70 percent of the women he studied would be separated as failures at the end of their junior year, only three percent would be eligible for the Recondo badge, and not one would receive the Army Physical Fitness badge…."

Still this is the Norm not the exception to the rule.

[Boulvae]

And thats why as the Norm and not the Exception, i'd never let woman in the army purely because ALOT of them would not make the grade. Sides letting in the very beings capable to giving birth, for only a limited time, to fight and die is rather impedeing on population fluctuation but alas my stand point of choice is above that opinion.

ANWAYS

This is a fantasy, even woman in fantasy could carry half a ton (600lbs) with one arm if it suits the creator's fancy.

[Rathenau]

Erm no, let's not even go there again. The fact that a world has fantasy elementals in it doesn’t mean you can discount any form of reason and physics just because there are things you cannot account for those. To be more specific; setting male and female on equal footing for the sake of political correctness is one thing, doing that same thing from the ground of fantasy is rather ignorant.

But on the topic of woman in the army; I actually have no problem with that whatsoever. If woman want the same rights as man or the other way around if you want, they should have the same obligations as well. Including being drafted for the army in times of war! Let's face it; in modern times it hardly matter if you are stronger or more acrobatic. Cannon fodder is cannon fodder no matter the gender, and I wouldn't mind defending the homeland with my female counterparts.

But WAR however isn't set in the modern world, it derives its setting from far before that, (ironically we are still talking about cannons here, excuse me for that) in a time where strength does matter in combat. As for your previous statement Foulpet, about the use of swords equalling a fight somewhat I greatly disagree. If anything it makes it even more unbalanced, if I may use that popular term. Medieval swords aren't much like the rapier of later times that are more used for thrusting then cutting or cleaving.

[Arijharn]

And thats why as the Norm and not the Exception, i'd never let woman in the army purely because ALOT of them would not make the grade. Sides letting in the very beings capable to giving birth, for only a limited time, to fight and die is rather impedeing on population fluctuation but alas my stand point of choice is above that opinion.

ANWAYS

This is a fantasy, even woman in fantasy could carry half a ton (600lbs) with one arm if it suits the creator's fancy.

Psst, it takes two to tango. I get your point though heh.